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post #591 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 10:56 PM
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How much will that add in FP ( Fish Power ) ???
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post #592 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 12:26 AM
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I can give it to ya in laymans terms... and as I understand it...

The idle system on my 106 motor is NOT controlled by the throttle body's butterfly.

The butterfly is CLOSED when the motor is idling.

This is done because the butterflies do not meter air that well when nearly closed. They may be fractionally open but not enough to supply idle air volume.

So.... with throttle butterflies closed the motor needs air to mix with fuel for idle.

It gets this fuel from a tube that delivers air downstream of the closed butterfly.

The amount of air delivered is controlled by a stepper motor... think of it as an electronically controlled valve that can be moved by the ECU.

Still with me... ok... the motor is now idling with a controlled air stream and controlled amount of fuel. The mixture is on the lean side hence we get exhaust popping when shutting off throttle... and to satisfy emissions in an ever restricting world.

We cant shift the amount of fuel the motor is getting at idle nor can we change the air flow provided by the stepper motor in a stock form.

To try to improve popping we have to think of a way to richen up the mixture as best as possible. You cant add more fuel but you can take away air by installing the Lloyds IAV.

This is installed in the line that the stepper motor gets its air from....

So you screw the IAV in until it starts to restrict the air available to the stepper motor so the idle mixture richens by restricting air not adding fuel.

Simple!!! The balancing act is to get the mixture rich enough to stop ( in most cases you only reduce it somewhat) popping without affecting idle quality or have the motor idle too low.

Thats why you must set IAV on a dead cold engine... and stay within Lloyds specs for idle speed with IAV installed.

You could restrict air in the air deliver tube where the IAV goes by installing a aquarium clamp that goes on air pump lines to restrict air flow.

Personally... I prefer the great quality of the Lloyds product and I think it would be more sensitive to airflow verses the clamped line. As the clamped line temp changes it expand/shrink changing airflow and need adjusting for these changes????

The IAV being metal is almost impervious to that trait.... and it doesnt clamp anything on the delivery line.

Mags

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post #593 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srenna54 View Post
How much will that add in FP ( Fish Power ) ???
Hehehehehehe Heaps!!! But it also adds more to the other FP (Frame Pulses)!!!

Mags

2012 Jackpot.
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post #594 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 04:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mags View Post
I can give it to ya in laymans terms... and as I understand it...

The idle system on my 106 motor is NOT controlled by the throttle body's butterfly.

The butterfly is CLOSED when the motor is idling.

This is done because the butterflies do not meter air that well when nearly closed. They may be fractionally open but not enough to supply idle air volume.

So.... with throttle butterflies closed the motor needs air to mix with fuel for idle.

It gets this fuel from a tube that delivers air downstream of the closed butterfly.

The amount of air delivered is controlled by a stepper motor... think of it as an electronically controlled valve that can be moved by the ECU.

Still with me... ok... the motor is now idling with a controlled air stream and controlled amount of fuel. The mixture is on the lean side hence we get exhaust popping when shutting off throttle... and to satisfy emissions in an ever restricting world.

We cant shift the amount of fuel the motor is getting at idle nor can we change the air flow provided by the stepper motor in a stock form.

To try to improve popping we have to think of a way to richen up the mixture as best as possible. You cant add more fuel but you can take away air by installing the Lloyds IAV.

This is installed in the line that the stepper motor gets its air from....

So you screw the IAV in until it starts to restrict the air available to the stepper motor so the idle mixture richens by restricting air not adding fuel.

Simple!!! The balancing act is to get the mixture rich enough to stop ( in most cases you only reduce it somewhat) popping without affecting idle quality or have the motor idle too low.

Thats why you must set IAV on a dead cold engine... and stay within Lloyds specs for idle speed with IAV installed.

You could restrict air in the air deliver tube where the IAV goes by installing a aquarium clamp that goes on air pump lines to restrict air flow.

Personally... I prefer the great quality of the Lloyds product and I think it would be more sensitive to airflow verses the clamped line. As the clamped line temp changes it expand/shrink changing airflow and need adjusting for these changes????

The IAV being metal is almost impervious to that trait.... and it doesnt clamp anything on the delivery line.

Mags
Great explanation!

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post #595 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 08:13 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by saddlebag View Post
Great explanation!
+1. I had an idea this is what it was doing but great to have confirmation in a good explanation.

Current Bike: 2011 Victory Cross Roads - Crimson
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post #596 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 09:57 AM
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i thought you might have a real working solution made from aerator parts. i'm too cheap for a real lloyds aav, but just clamping off the line isn't really an option.

now , 2011 crossroads
in order of ownership, sears compact scooter, honda 305 scrambler, honda 160 dream , triumph 500 trophy trail, honda cb450, sportster, honda f750, 2nd sportster, harley flh, harley super glide, 3rd sportster, bmw k1000, harley low rider, 2nd harley super glide, harley heratage, harley road king,
thats just the street bikes!
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post #597 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-07-2013, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ridealittle View Post
i thought you might have a real working solution made from aerator parts. i'm too cheap for a real lloyds aav, but just clamping off the line isn't really an option.
You wouldn't need to clamp a line using aquarium parts. You can actually use an air line valve if you know the correct size of the tube. Here is an example:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...17&pcatid=8017

Current Bike: 2011 Victory Cross Roads - Crimson
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Other: Signal Dynamic LED Plate frame w/BackOff XP / Clearwater Glenda LED Lights / 3BRPowersports USB in-bag power port / Utopia police backrest w/quick-out / D&D Boss slip-ons (569-12F)
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post #598 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-09-2013, 10:54 PM
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adjustable air valve

Years ago I used one of the adjustable air valves from the aquarium air pumps on water injection systems I had installed on a couple of my personal trucks. Worked good. They were inexpensive and never gave me any trouble. Good to see there is a part that we can actually afford to install on our bikes without taking out a small loan
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post #599 of 1057 (permalink) Old 01-16-2013, 09:24 PM
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Excellent info on this thread. I had looked at putting in a Lloydz IAV at the recommendation of a respected riding buddy who's a motor head and knows about this stuff. When I checked out the Lloydz website I came across the VFC III fuel controller that they offer. Can someone offer me their pros and cons for layin out $300 for this upgrade?

BELAY MY LAST SHIPMATES.. Just read the last 10 pages of this thread and got all the info that I was looking for. You gentlemen on this forum are a treasure trove of information.

You're gonna be dead a long time, what are you waitin for?!
DOC
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Last edited by albradburn; 01-16-2013 at 10:07 PM.
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post #600 of 1057 (permalink) Old 02-09-2013, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by bryman View Post
I got the LLoyd's IAV and air filter for Christmas. Looking forward to seeing how it plays with the PowrPro and my D&D exhaust.
Searching for some info on this thread I was just wondering how you made out with your lloyds IAV and filter. What differences have you noticed? Also wondering how your powerpro is set up in regards to the o2 sensor connection. Are you running o2 at all or are you using powerpro connections? I currently am running no o2 connection to powerpro. Just stock o2.

2011 Cross Country. D&D's wrapped - VM1DR cams - PC5 - LLoyds high performance filter and ATS (Adjustable Timing system). Power output 115HP/115FTLBS tuned by KMC. Klock Werks flip shield - RF/PBR300x4 amp - Hertz HCX 6.5's - Victory 6X9 Magnum Lids - Victory XM - HMD Black Pull Backs with Victory performance grips. PIAA Led3 driving lights. accessories from Arlen ness - Witch Doctors - Noemtz Designs - Kuryakyn. Blacked out treatment powder Coat by PPC Stuart fl.
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