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Witchdoctor Customer Service

10K views 63 replies 19 participants last post by  JPokerwinski 
#1 ·
I purchased Crimson Red paint for my 2011 Kingpin to get my saddlebags painted through Witchdoctors. Bought parts from them before and always been pleased. Ordered the proper codes. Witchdoctor gets paint from AXALTA, who makes the paint for Victory bikes. Witchdoctor orders proper codes. Can comes in with proper codes. Go to pick up my saddlebags for my Crimson Red Metallic Kingpin and they're DARK BURGUNDY! Not even close. I call and leave message at Witchdoctors. I message Witchdoctors and Jon. No replies. Monday AM and I get a text from Robyn at Witchdoctors. Send her picture of the paint on outside of can. She agrees, that's DARK! Takes information and says she'll be leaving at lunch cause she's under the weather, but they'll be working on it. I call AXALTA.... Mistake! Most frustrating people in the world. They kept telling me to call Victory. I explained at least 3 times that I was the end user and that Witchdoctors (an aftermarket company) ordered the paint from them. "Call Victory"....

I call Witchdoctors to see if any headway. NO JOY! Robyn has left and the tech I'm dealing with has zero knowledge of the situation AND Robyn didn't document anything on the computer. Asked for Jon. THAT'S NOT HAPPENING. Contact him through Face Book. I tried... Saturday. NO response. Well WE don't call Jon.....

OK. I've paid for paint and hardener. I have to pay the painter. I'm going to need more paint. I'm going to need another paint job.

It looks like I'm going to be left hanging in the wind, caught in a pissing match between the paint manufacturer and Witchdoctor trying to determine who screwed up.

HELP!!! Suggestions ?????
 
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#56 ·
Agree.

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#3 ·
I agree with @shanko. Also Witchdoctor should reimburse you for the full amount you paid for this paint job, then they can go after Axalta to re-coup their funds. You did business in good faith and didn't nothing wrong, why should you bear the expense.
 
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#57 ·
Completely agree.

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#4 ·
So Witchdoctor ordered the paint AND painted the bags? It sucks to be Witchdoctor right now but I wholly agree with Pain - they dropped the ball at every turn. If they had just sold you the paint I could cut them some slack but even then they'd be on the hook for paint replacement without question. But having their own painter open the can, prep the bags and spray them out without ever noticing the color discrepancy is utterly cut and dried, they gotta fix it from top to bottom with no further cost to you. I bet they will straighten it out once Robyn recuperates.
 
#6 ·
ID, I didn't read WD did the actual painting. I thought he meant he got the paint from them and had someone local spray them. Now you got me wondering who did what....or who's on first
 
#5 ·
@Pheonix ....I was about to hit the sack but had another idea pop in :crzy:. Before you plaster WD, maybe you can work out an arrangement and get them to handle shipping and a full re-paint.

Good luck with how this comes out. I hope WD steppes up and does the right thing.
 
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#7 · (Edited)
I am interested to see how this turns out, never had a problem with WD myself. I am also disapointed to hear that Jon (the owner) would not talk to you or return your call. Jon used to post on this site years ago but he dropped this forum in favor of the 3 lettered one which I also was disapointed with. Since this bike will be my first and last Polaris product I am not too worried about it.
 
#8 ·
Update

WD did not do the painting. When I ordered the paint, I asked if it was Colorite. They said it was OEM. I asked if it was Midwaest and they said yes. It was not Midwest, but a company I've never heard of, Axalta. Jon did PM me late last night. He basically said that IF they sent the wrong paint, they would refund the cost of the paint. I'm out the cost of the first paint job and have to pay to have repainted. We'll see how that goes. I'm attaching 2 pics. The side cover is off the bike. The can is what Jon sold me. The side cover is black plastic and the paint on the side of the can is on a white label and so thin you can still read the writing on the label. That shows you how dark it is. I think they sent Midnight Cherry with a wrong label.
 

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#39 ·
WD did not do the painting. When I ordered the paint, I asked if it was Colorite. They said it was OEM. I asked if it was Midwaest and they said yes. It was not Midwest, but a company I've never heard of, Axalta. Jon did PM me late last night. He basically said that IF they sent the wrong paint, they would refund the cost of the paint. I'm out the cost of the first paint job and have to pay to have repainted. We'll see how that goes. I'm attaching 2 pics. The side cover is off the bike. The can is what Jon sold me. The side cover is black plastic and the paint on the side of the can is on a white label and so thin you can still read the writing on the label. That shows you how dark it is. I think they sent Midnight Cherry with a wrong label.
WD did offer to refund you the cost of paint if it is the wrong colour code.

That said I will be the first to admit I know nothing about painting, and colour matching. I did watch a car show on TV where they showed the difference in between darkness with red paint on white primer, and black primer. The difference was big. That's why I asked about the primer used.

I really feel for Pheonix because I would be just as pissed myself. I would be on WD to help me correct the situation, but I wouldn't expect Jon to cover the cost of the painter. If WD did the painting that would be a different story. Phoenix should have brought another panel to the painter to make sure it colour matches. The painter should have tried painting a piece of scrap to make sure it colour matches before laying it on the saddlebags.
 
#9 ·
Not trying to be an ass but most likely I don't understand. Why didn't anyone ever pop the top of the paint can to verify it was close prior to application. Not trying to put the blame on you per say but why wasn't it checked?
I have had stuff sent to me wrong all the time and I trust nobody.
 
#10 ·
Yeah, that was my bad. When I ordered OEM from Midwest and saw the statement on WD's web page about meeting Polaris' Master Color Standards, I thought I was good......
 
#11 ·
And.... still nothing from Witchdoctor.......
 
#12 ·
I misunderstood so I'm reversing my previous statement - if Witchdoctors did not do the painting they have a much narrower responsibility. I'm pretty sure that somewhere on a receipt or order form there's a disclaimer that customer is responsible for verifying color match before spraying, and liability is limited to replacement of the paint. Even though such disclaimers are standard procedure it doesn't quite balance with their other statement that their paints match Polaris' Master Color Standards - umm apparently NOT. Actually it IS a perfect match, just for some other bike not yours. The old cup and ball....
 
#14 ·
I misunderstood so I'm reversing my previous statement . I'm pretty sure that somewhere on a receipt or order form there's a disclaimer that customer is responsible for verifying color match before spraying, and liability is limited to replacement of the paint
Before I spouted off I went over the WD web site and checked for any statement on this, of course I can't know what's on the receipt and paper work.
 
#13 · (Edited)
On a six year old bike I would have checked the colour ahead of time in any case. Exposure to the elements could have caused a slight colour shift that would have to be adjusted for. I used a red touch-up paint for rock chips from ColorRite on my last bike and you could see the difference even from 20 feet away. I confirmed it was their paint that was off but the variation of either can happen.

I'm a strong believer that if you are going through a professional painter for a match job you need to give them a piece like a side cover to compare. Some of those guys can do magic when they know what they're going for.

In this case, WD just passed the product through their house so no blame there. The painter had no idea there'd be a difference so no blame there either if it was mixed correctly. You didn't get any straight answer out of them when you called so I doubt very much some guy supplying the paint will care that you didn't confirm the colour before applying it. In my mind they are partly to blame but had you caught it ahead of time would have probably replaced it free of charge. I imagine their liability stops there.

In any case, good luck with that.
 
#17 ·
That's the correct code, but that number is nowhere on can or paperwork. Wasn't on WD's website, but he pulled the product off so it cannot be seen.

Now Jon is telling me that the paint he sent is right, but my bike is wrong... Go figure. I sent him a very long PM reply yesterday with pics of my bike, other 2011 Pins, 2010 bikes in Midnight Cherry and 2012-2015 bikes in Sunset Red. When presented with facts, he told me I was condescending and if I didn't change, he was done. This was after he told me I needed to listen to him, and I didn't know what I was talking about. GREAT customer service........ His resolution is figuring out what color my bike is and selling me more paint.
 
#16 ·
I would also have let the body shop try and match the paint or better yet just have you whole bike repainted.
 
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#18 ·
As much as so many like to spout about how great WD is, I'm not sure why except that its some sort of "group-think" mind control.... I've personally have had two very dis-satisfactory interactions with the company's CS. I won't do business with them unless I absolutely have too.
Plus Jon tries to present himself as some pillar of the Victory community.....When after watching his hamfisted "DIY" vids, loaded with much mis-information and bad technique, listening to his moronic explanations and opinions as well a reading accounts like what @Pheonix posted above....The truth pops right out, Jon has no regard for his customers or the Victory community when a $ is involved.
 
#19 ·
Yeah, on one of the FB pages that's affiliated with the "3 Letter" Victory chat room, I was told that Jon was God in the Church of Victory. I was also told to burn my bike several times.... At that point I deleted the post and left the page.....
 
#24 ·
If you have proof WD said it would be Midwest than I would just file a claim with your credit card company since you didn't get the brand you asked for. Then just order some paint from Paulie and get it painted right. If WD is going to fight with you just like Pain says move on to someone else.
 
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#26 ·
Don't know. That's why I gave the painter the phone number of the manufacturer. He asked the same question..... He used what they told him.
 
#28 ·
Why wouldn't it be WD's fault? Yes they are the "reseller" but so is any company you buy something from. The person you buy a product from should stand by that product and if there is a problem then that company should make it right and then said company will need to go after the company they bought the product from.
 
#30 ·
I sell Ford body parts all day long to local and distant body shops . They never check them , sand and paint them , go to install and OOPS , they ordered the wrong fucking side . Now they return the panel or fender back to me painted . Worthless for resale .

I guess I don't know what my point is , but this **** happens on a weekly basis , and all the shops are guilty of it .
 
#32 ·
Well... Here's Witchdoctors final resolution:

"The manufacturer called me back last night and they suggested that what they can offer is you send the paint back to us or them directly and they will look at the paint to see if it possibly could have been the wrong color or the wrong label on the can. If that is the case that they gave that up they will refund the money no problem. If not there's nothing anyone can do as no one on our end or the manufacturer made a mistake. Let me know if you would like to do that"

The first obvious thing is that WD Jon is not going to refund squat, even though I purchased from him.
The second thing is I'm going to have to pay shipping on a crapshoot for a refund.
Last, if I send the can back, I have no leg to stand on and can't prove anything.

Open to suggestions here. My brain is FU over all of this. I have filed a complaint with the Youngstown, OH BBB. WD is not a member (go figure), but it puts them on the radar for them and documents how he operates for any future potential customers that think about doing business with them. I have also filed a complaint through my banks Complaint/Fraud Division (that's what they call it, I didn't consider it fraud) to see if I can get it back charged since I put it on plastic. That's why I'm not sure if I want to give up the can of paint at this point.
 
#35 ·
You should never just hand a painter a can of paint and think he is going to color match other parts. You should always give them a good sample with the color and gloss you are trying to match. Painting is an art and needs to be done in a certain order to make sure you get even close on a color match. Once you open the can and start mixing the paint you own it.
 
#41 ·
I've been in distribution for 22 years. **** happens, it's how you fix mistakes that show's how you value customers and says everything about your business. The manufacturer won't talk to you because you are not their customer, WD is, that's why they go through distribution so they don't have to deal direct. Pay the shipping back to WD and you should be refunded the cost of paint plus shipping.
 
#43 ·
I see there is too many people to blame. WD doesn't open the paint can to see what's in there they trust the vendor.
Your painter should of asked you for a sample piece. So he could lighten it or darkening it to get a perfect match. You should've given him a sample.

So WD dropped the ball helping you. It can happen when someone goes home sick and does leave messages behind.

Send the paint back and go from there. Trust them that they're going to do the right thing, Yes you're out money but if they send you the right paint you can move forward.
 
#46 ·
Send the paint back and go from there. Trust them that they're going to do the right thing, Yes you're out money but if they send you the right paint you can move forward.
I understand what you're saying. That's a mighty big "IF" to throw more money away on the cost of shipping back to him. He has given me every reason NOT to trust him to be honorable in dealings with him. All it takes is the manufacturer to say they didn't make a mistake, or him not shipping it to them and saying that's what they said, and I'm out paint, painting AND shipping. Kinda insult to injury...
 
#47 ·
From what it is worth... from my legal eagle brother . " WD is liable for the cost to replace plus shipping" the MFG is responsible for damages for the mis-Label. Problem is collecting without getting an attorney
 
#48 ·
Yeah, Jim, sometimes it's easier to go around a wall rather than try and climb it. If my bank determines WD was wrong, they will back charge it. I'll eat the cost of painting......
 
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#52 · (Edited)
You gotta give WD the chance to fix the problem since he made on offer if not you will have not get a charge back from your credit card because you didn't give him the chance to correct the mistake after he offered to.
 
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#53 ·
you could ask WD if they have more of the paint on the shelf. Then ask them to open it and see what color is inside. There might be more then one bad can.


with the internet and forums now days you can get a bad word real fast. I don't think WD is a bad company
 
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#54 ·
Resolved

Well, it's good morning for redemption. The Tarheels won the National Championship and a refund showed up in my checking account for the cost of the paint. My banks Dispute/Fraud Dept. investigated the complaint I filed and charged back the cost of the paint against WD. The painter is going to re-paint the bags at no charge. I have a tube of Crimson Red touch up paint coming from Color Rite to compare color before ordering what is needed to paint bags. The color swatch they have on-line looks identical to what's on the bike.
 
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