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Best cams for low rpm riders?

45K views 193 replies 24 participants last post by  Travis P 
#1 ·
I miss my power....The stage 1 XC pulls pretty good and is fine for cruising but I feel like its barely enough power when needed for passing and getting around traffic.
I've been talking with Lloydz over the last few weeks to have it done right and minimize any heat off the rear can(I don't want to go there again...). Anyway, I got the work order and estimate from Lloydz and they spec'd VM1-DR cams. After looking into these I'm wondering if there isn't a better cam option for lower RPM torque?
 
#2 ·
Hotter cams generally move the torque and power range higher not lower.
Victory motor will never pull down low the way a Harley does.
Try changing down a gear when you need torque and power.
Put the engine in its sweet spot and you won't be left wanting.
 
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#3 ·
There was another cam that was better for the lower RPM ( forgot the name )

I got the Lloyd's cams and that's for the higher RPM .. suites me just fine ....

If you want low RPM power why not an UD pulley ?? That's just awesome ..

Andre
@
TaPaTaLk
 
#5 ·
The wyrd brothers cams (Victory) appear to have the most torque in between 2500 to 3000 rpm. Maybe those will tickle your torque taste buds? :smile
 
#11 ·
This option is off the table.....I'm sinking all my money into the XC. Besides, a new bike means starting from square one....and everyone knows this is true. ;)
 
#13 ·
True ..but I don't need your financial advice. Now, got any wiser advice on cams?
 
#16 ·
With Lloydz going to Sturgis in 10 days or sooner and being gone for maybe 2 weeks it will give you time to do research. I know on facebook The Vic Shop and Kevinx has a lot of dyno runs posted so maybe you can find what you're looking for. Look up The Dyno Guys all so they have been doing a lot of Vic's there.
Good Luck
 
#18 ·
I'm going to finish this season up as is. The target date for this Lloydz work is late March/early April 2017. The shop is booked until November anyway.....
 
#17 ·
Maybe we can get a cam party for the northeast. I'd be interested, and would give me time to save up...
 
#19 ·
Do both. Get the recommended cam, the one that doesn't fall on it's face when you rev it. Then in a year or two when your ready for a new belt buy the under-drive pulley. When your done it'll be just right.
 
#21 ·
Had all the goodies except cams....
Took all that **** off and went back to stage 1...
Now you want cams...

Cams with what you have now would be the same as what you had before and no cams as far as power goes. In fact, the set-up you had before would make the best low end (like you say you want).

I have no advice for you. Been down this road once.
 
#22 ·
Its my f**king bike and money...I have no idea what some of your issues are with what I do with them.....? :mad: Go read another thread if you have nothing to add but your un-needed negative opinion.

I'm not happy with the power my engine is making now. So I called Lloydz and spoke with them at length about the heat issues and what I want. If you actually take time to read before you inject opinions, you know the shop feels confident they can get me where I want without issues. I'm willing to give it a second go, this time done professionally and by the master....Lloydz, may even have something "special" for my XC by the time of this work(I'm not at liberty to talk about it).
I will be keeping the Tri-Ovals as they are known to make excellent torque on the dyno.
 
#25 · (Edited)
I had Lloyds cams, Lloyds 1/4 turn throttle ring, a PCV and a dyno tune done at The Vic Shop in the Summer of 2013. Rylan suggested the DR cams over the HPT cams for my CCT. He certainly made the right call IMHO. Upon arrival to The Vic Shop my CCT had the Lloyds timing wheel set at +4, Tri Ovals and a Lloyds air cleaner. My final numbers were 112hp and 113tq.

I also feel the engine and exhaust heat was reduced nearly 50% after The Vic Shop visit. I tried disconnecting my 02 sensors but my CCT ran so poorly I re-connected them after only a half a day ride.

People like to claim 'better' or 'higher' peak numbers, but I have yet to see any set of Cross bike mufflers with a higher, wider and a flatter torque curve than the Tri Ovals. They remain the best 'performing' mufflers I've seen for a Cross bike. Of course they're too expensive but they simply offer the best 'performance' I've seen. If I see a higher, wider and a flatter torque curve from another set of slip ons, I'll certainly take a serious look. Higher peak numbers are fine for the 'mine's bigger' crowd but getting the 3 part combination is the real target in my book.

By the time you get your work done at Lloyds in the Spring of 2017, you'll likely have many more options than I did in the Summer of 2013 or that you would have today. I suspect Lloyd, S&S, Wyrd Brothers and others will continue their performance options for the Victory 106. It's certainly a good time to be running these bikes.

All the best to you PaiN.


On a side note. I returned recently from a quick trip to Norfolk, VA. The temps averaged between 95 and 105. Yes sir, it was HOT. But heat off my CCT engine and exhaust was not an issue as long as I was moving.

PS - the infrastructure engineers in and around Norfolk should be knee capped. The stand still traffic 'flow' leaving Norfolk at 3:00pm on a Friday afternoon was beyond awful.
 
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#26 ·
@Chattanooga Mark Thank you very much, great info and all you wrote makes me feel good for where I'm going with this.
 
#28 ·
I'm happy to see you wanting cams buddy. My bro tried to talk you into it when you picked up the fender haha! If he was on the forums he'd be all over this telling you that you should get them. I've ridden his bike, and it's great. I am saving for cams now.

One of the biggest things he said was how it reduced the heat coming off the engine. Regardless, going with Lloydz you will have then done right! I have to get down there for a dyno tune when I get my cams in but I can remember when I went down with my old Vegas in 2007. Lloyd is a great guy and he's pretty hyper and funny as hell.

Best of luck and hopefully I'll have cams before you do! HA!
 
#30 ·
After a very long career in IT, I have seen issues like this many times. User says: "My computer doesn't work right when I do XXXXX.0"
The techs explain what they are doing wrong and how to make it right. A week later user calls up with the same complaint. Over and over. No matter how they try, the techs cannot get the user to do it right.
If you want low RPM power buy a diesel, not a Victory.:smile
 
#36 ·
Thank you, that illustrates what I meant perfectly. For me, giving up 12 HP for that little bump at the bottom... especially since the cost of both is the same... wouldn't be worth it to me. 115/114 beats 103/110 all day every day. So what if I have to exceed 3000 rpm? Not a big deal for these OHC/4-valve engines.
 
#38 ·
.... There ....
Smile

Andre
@
TaPaTaLk
 
#42 · (Edited)
Kyle's cams are great if I had been able to ride a bike with the vm1's to compare them side by side I would have probably left KMC's in and saved the money on getting some forced induction. If you do most of your riding in a stop and go city environment hands down KMC cams. There is zero stumble with those cams off idle and are great off the line. If your the type of rider who shifts around 3,000 rpms and is content with speed limit speeds then vm1's are not for you get all of Lloydz other goodies and leave the vm1's alone they will disappoint if you are not an aggressive rider, look into KMC's torque cams or the new Vic S&S cams as an option. Its easy to look at a couple of graphs and want the highest numbers however if your riding style does not match where the power comes in at, all that power up top does you no good.
 
#46 ·
if your riding style does not match where the power comes in at, all that power up top does you no good.
Or... you could modify your riding style a little. I know, it's a bitch to wind that thing all the way out... you know... to 3500-4000 rpm.:eek

The 'torque cams' are only 2 to 4 ft-lbs stronger down low, and the VM-1s are 12 HP stronger upstairs. Trust me... once that tach gets to 3100 you'll forget all about that 4 ft-lbs. The engine covers that 2200-3000 rpm range really quick if you're in the throttle much at all.
 
#43 ·
Let me apologize for going off in this thread. Normally I let things roll and I just ignore what I don't like... but I got injured prior to the posting I was in a lot of pain, very uncomfortable and pissy as hell. I'm more or less better, at least, the pain and discomfort have eased and I can get back to business.

Anyway, I've thought this upgrade out and decided to do it in steps. One because, I want install things one at time to find out if the "heat issue" returns. Second is cost...buying parts from Lloydz and having them install these is much more expensive than buying them on-line and installing myself. Besides saving significant money this will also spread the cost over time and make it easier on me. Plus I get my performance back now :D

I purchased a PC-V and ATS. The ATS is going in first, which I'll test today. The PC-V will go on tomorrow, when I install the KW bars, Barnett clutch cable and new rear pads. The PC came from CycleSolutions, these guys sell at a very reasonable cost and included a custom map based on the setup. I'm running the Vic hi-flo AF not the Lloydz but I should be in the ball park of where I left off performance wise and this is how I plan to run for the rest of the season. Next spring, if all has gone well, I'll have decided on what cams I want. Then they can be installed and a dyno tune done.
 
#44 ·
I'll be installing Lloydz cams Friday at my brother's shop (where you picked up the fender). I am sure, come spring, if you wanted some help doing it, him and I could be available for a Saturday or Sunday to save you some money on install!
 
#45 ·
Or I will do it for you pAiN ?? For free, no charge, just need a bed and breakfast ?? Oh ja and a ticket ??

Andre
@
TaPaTaLk
 
#49 ·
I guess this question is mostly for Half_Crazy:

I understand that there is very nice power to be had at 3,000+ RPM on these engines. But what, if anything, can be done to increase the torque/HP below 3,000 RPM on these bikes (while maintaining the high RPM torque/HP)? Is it possible to have the best of both worlds?

Here is the graph for my bike and my mods are in my signature:

 
#50 ·
I guess this question is mostly for Half_Crazy:



I understand that there is very nice power to be had at 3,000+ RPM on these engines. But what, if anything, can be done to increase the torque/HP below 3,000 RPM on these bikes (while maintaining the high RPM torque/HP)? Is it possible to have the best of both worlds?



Here is the graph for my bike and my mods are in my signature:




Nice dyno chart. HC I too am curious of the answer to WR's question. I would like a blend of the "best of both worlds". For the touring I do, a nice smooth running bike from with a little grunt from1000rpm - 3000rpm would be good, but something that comes alive a little up in that 4rpm range would be sweet too.
 
#51 ·
@WeekendRider that's a sweet power curve you have there thumb up I think that would make the bike feel great riding around "normally" and be balls-out for passing.
 
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#53 · (Edited)
Thank you (as if I had anything to do with it other than the installation of parts...thank you to Victory, Lloyds, Dynojet, RCX and the tune from KevinX.) I love my CC. It cruises nicely and when I kick it down a gear to pass it really moves.

But at the risk of getting kicked in the teeth from all the high RPM devotees, I prefer cruising in the 2250 to 3100 RPM range. In the lower part of this range, if I need to accelerate in a normal riding situation, the engine isn't terribly responsive to my needs...or perhaps I should say it isn't as responsive as my VTX was in this range (I know, different bikes/engines/gearing.) And when having a little fun off the line, the engine doesn't kick like the VTX did - off the line that is. I don't want anyone to get caught up in the comparison of the bikes, because that certainly isn't my point. My point is that if there is a way to improve the power in the lower RPM range and keep what I have at the higher RPM range, and it didn't break the bank, I would be very interested.
 
#54 ·
What are the Pros and Cons of making this mod. I'm greedy and want to keep what I have and improve what I don't.
 
#57 ·
You can get either a speedohealer or a speedo drd to fix the speedometer. The ud pulley with fit all the narrow frames but geting ahold of one is gonna be the tough part. I just picked up a used one and having it instaled on Monday in Sturgis.
 
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