Victory Motorcycle Forum banner

Dual front disc on a Judge

11K views 38 replies 10 participants last post by  BP6666VR 
#1 ·
Has anyone done it?
 
#2 ·
Ive thought about it on my Vegas which is same as a Judge really except for wheel size.
I bought an XC billet 18" front wheel as it has bolt holes for two disc rotors and it fits my conventional forks using all the same spacers and axle off my 21" wheel.
The problem lies then in where to bolt the second caliper töo as theres no lugs on the other lower fork leg so youve gotta weld some on in the right place and strip the forks right down after marking where youre gonna weld or the heat generated will probably mess up your fork internals.
The other way to go is bolt an entire Hammer S fork assembly including triple trees to your judge.
With the price of Vic parts you may be better off moneywise to graft on an entire Jap superbike front end off a GSXR1000 or similar...I've seen similar setups on hotrodded Harleys before.
Any other ideas I'd love to hear as really our single disc fronts are barely adequate at speed.
Upgrade to Lyndals performance pads is the cheapest way to get better front braking.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GatorJoe
#34 ·
So I have toyed with the idea of the Kingpin front forks similar to what you did, but then I was just thinking, I'm not sure how the leg lengths compare, but if it would work, could a set of Cross bike trees and legs be put on a Highball?

There would be a few perks, I'm thinking it would be slightly taller (which would help since I'm overheight on my rear suspension), it would take the bike to inverted forks, and then potentially use a cross bike wheel, with dual rotors, and the opportunity to run a 160 front like I have on my CrossRoads.

Your thoughts please?
 
#3 ·
why not
you would need different master cylinder
brake lines
wheel
rotor
fork
am sure you can find all the parts used, Look on ebay or pinwall cycle
 
#4 ·
Quick and easy..notice I'm not saying cheap...triple trees, forks, front master cylinder, brake lines, front wheel off a Hammer S or a Cross Country/Cross Roads.
 
#5 ·
My guess would be the Hammer S setup would be a straight bolt up.
Until I ran a tape over a XC/XR headstem and bearings I wouldnt know, measure up the next one you see.
Personally Id be on the lookout at insurance auctions for a Hammer S thats been hit up the arse,
Id get the whole complete front end as well as the 106 motor for mine and part out the rest of it.
 
#6 ·
I thought that as well MB. Next time I'm at the Victory dealer I'll scope out the Hammer's headstem size.
 
#7 ·
the triple trees are 50mm and the fit is


Year Product Model Assembly
2016 VIC HAMMER 8 BALL INTL/HAMMER S ALL OPTIONS (R01) SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V16HA36/HS36 ALL OPTIONS (49VICFORKS11KP)
2015 VIC HAMMER 8 BALL/SPORT INTL SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V15HA36/HR/HS36 (49VICFORKS11KP)
2014 VIC HAMMER 8 BALL/S INTL/S LE INTL SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V14HA36/HS36 (49VICFORKS11KP)
2013 VIC HAMMER 8 BALL/S INTL SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V13HA36/HS36 (49VICFORKS11KP)
2012 VIC KINGPIN SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V12CB36NP/NPC/NPA (49VICFORKS11KP)
2012 VIC HAMMER S/8 BALL ALL OPTIONS SUSPENSION, FRONT FORKS - V12HS36/HA36 ALL OPTIONS (49VICFORKS11KP)
 
#10 ·
Thanks guys. It's do-able but expensive.
I am hoping to get a wreck, do it that way.. Otherwise a trade looms as that single disc up from just sometimes is not enough at speed. Had another "moment" today...
 
#12 ·
Oeps .... What brake pads are you using now ???
 
#11 ·
#13 ·
@AfterDarker ...yeah mate what pads have you got as stock pads are not real flash under duress:eek
I went to Lyndals Z-plus front and rear for more 'bite'
Wouldve gone to Lyndals Gold on the front but then I was running the skinny 90 90 21" front...whereas now Im running the fat 130 70 18 front Id have the traction to go to pads with even more bite.
Now my rear brake can be relied upon she pulls up fairly well using both brakes.
I'd still like to go twin disc though....oh make sure we are not bidding against each other when one comes up
 
#14 ·
Was thinking if its feasilble to use a lh lower fork leg on the right side reversed.
Logistically the axle location would need to be same from either side.
Next time I got the front axle out Ill see if it can go in from the other side and be secure.
If it will then theres just the aesthetics of having one caliper behind the fork leg and the other in front! .. Could you live with that for better braking performance?
 
#15 ·
Different lowers?

Different lower legs as far as how the axle is held in place? The X bikes have to different lower legs one leg the axle screws into and the other leg holds the axles by pinch bolts.
 
#16 ·
Different lower legs as far as how the axle is held in place? The X bikes have to different lower legs one leg the axle screws into and the other leg holds the axles by pinch bolts.
Vegas/Judge/Highball/Gunner/Jackpot all have axle pinchbolts on both sides.
As far as the X bikes come into the discussion well they don't really as they already have twin discs on USD forks.
We are tryna suss out ways of going twin disc cheaper than grafting on an entire Hammer S or XC front end.
On our bikes the axle doesn't actually screw into the lower leg in just slides in and the axle fastener screws into the axle from the opposite side. the pinch bolts on both sides secure the axle.
That's the best way I can describe it.
Thanks for your input Speedblue and others.
Keep them ideas coming as there's more that one way to skin a cat
 
#19 · (Edited)
Half crazy maybe you are fully crazy! I have a stage one on my Judge - an ECU chip from Lloydz, K&N air filter, 2 into 1 RPW Thor exhaust with minimal baffles, the thing goes quick, yet only one front disc, I tell you it doesn't stop too quick! I have a steel braided brake line and certainly new after market brake pads, I actually forget the brand EBC I think but was a specialist after market brand, best I could get according to wheel specialist that fitted it.

Put it this way I go riding with a bunch of guys on sport bikes, Ducatis, BMWs mainly and one guy on a HD Road King, they all have dual front discs except me and apart from the HD my bike is probably the f'ing heaviest, ie most mass and needs most stopping power. I mean a Ducati is 100 kg lighter than our Victories it will stop so much quicker than our tractors. I love the Victory torque love the motor, love the ride, but hate the f'ing brakes! So easy to lock up the back wheel, I have done that quite a few times. Of course 70% of braking is from the front.

Appreciate all the info being put on here, thanks guys, especially MBX cheers mate, useful stuff to know.

But still, no one has seemed to have actually carried out a successful single to dual front brake conversion on any Victory single front disc model ... as far as I can see. Have I missed something? There are various suggestions, but no one seems to have actually done it.
 
#18 ·
better heat dissipation through two rotors, one would think, as well as a greater surface area of pad on rotor.
May or may not result in needing less pressure on the lever to stop.
My GPZ900R had twin front discs and it pulled up a helluva lot better than my Vic and from much higher speeds.
Have I missed anything?
well there's the visual aspect too but that's not of primary concern.
 
#20 · (Edited)
Guess you did not follow post #11 there is a link to a website

http://www.motorcycle.com/how-to/victory-vegas-8ball-project-evil-8-part-2-90808.html

And there they've done it .... And a turbo charged member on this site did it too ....

The coolest way would be the 40° link
http://www.kewlmetalstore.com/product_info.php?products_id=83
i send you before instead of the Jackpot to install the Hammer one ... Same price .... Only the hoses and calipers need extra ..... All in the link above mate ...

Yes agree with your post ... Compare to other victory or HD or other V-twin our single disks actually breaks shorter ...

But not compare to racers .... I'll look up a link that i posted before in brake distance in meters

EDIT, i could not find it but this info will do .... Victory is in the list
Brake distance in ft

http://www.svrider.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-307050.html

Superbikes:
•2011 BMW S1000RR: 129 ft
•2011 Ducati 1198: 141 ft
•2011 Honda CBR1000RR: 134 ft
•2011 Suzuki GSXR-1000: 140 ft
•2011 KTM RC8R: 135 ft
•2011 Kawasaki ZX10R: 129 ft
•2011 Yamaha R1: 137 ft

Supersports:
•2011 Yamaha R6: 124 ft
•2011 Honda CBR600RR: 126 ft
•2011 Ducati 848 EVO: 127 ft
•2011 Triumph 675R: 126 ft
•2011 Suzuki GSXR-600: 122 ft

Other bikes:
•2015 Harley Street 750: 152 ft
•2011 Harley StreetGlide: 129 ft
•2011 Star Stratoliner: 142 ft
•2011 Kawasaki Vulcan Vaquero: 144 ft
•2013 BMW R1200-RTP: 144 ft
•2013 Harley Electra Glide: 144 ft
•2010 Star Raider S: 124 ft
•2010 Harley Softail Rocker C: 125 ft
•2010 Victory Vegas Jackpot: 129 ft

OR

http://www.motorcycle-vermont.com/the-effect-of-motorcycle-type-on-braking-distance/

.
GOOGLE is your friend ....

,
 
#22 ·
Good post, thanks BPR. Appreciate the links. All points to fitting a Hammer front end as the way to go. Only problem, and it is a big problem, is cost. The local Victory shop here in Sydney quoted me $7K + to fit a Hammer front end to the Judge! Farrk I will trade the Judge rather than pay stupid money to do that.

I was surprised by that brake comparison, maybe I should fit a set of trick brake levers to try and get better leverage? I have to squeeze the **** out of the brake lever to get adequate bite sometimes... I will develop a handshake like Schwarzenegger riding this bike... not all bad I suppose.

Can't believe you ride your own machine over there on a relatively remote part of Indonesia, you surely must be king of the island in amongst 10,000 scooters!
 
#21 ·
interesting that a Vegas JACKPOT pulls up from 60 mph in the same 129 feet as a ZX10 !!! and a Harley Streetglide!
OK double that speed and see the stopping distances:eek

By the way AfterDarker, with the Lloyds modified ECU whats your top end speed so far?......does it over-ride the factory rev limiter through the gears and you don't say you have a fuel controller.
Mine feels strongest in 5th and Id hazard a guess that itd be faster in 5th than 6th gear.
 
#23 ·
interesting that a Vegas JACKPOT pulls up from 60 mph in the same 129 feet as a ZX10 !!! and a Harley Streetglide!

OK double that speed and see the stopping distances:eek



By the way AfterDarker, with the Lloyds modified ECU whats your top end speed so far?......does it over-ride the factory rev limiter through the gears and you don't say you have a fuel controller.

Mine feels strongest in 5th and Id hazard a guess that itd be faster in 5th than 6th gear.

I have given it absolutely everything a couple of times (private roads one in Victorian high country and another near Walcha NSW) and the calibration on the bloody speedo makes it hard to read after 140 kmh, they bunch it up, but I had it complete flat chat at about 200 kmh and felt the rev limiter cut in, fifth is best sixth is an overdrive. Sorry when I say chip I mean the Lloydz Gen III fuel controller fitted. Have a small fairing, really you need a decent fairing and rear mounted pegs and low bars to start doing "proper" top speeds, but it's all good fun.

I suppose I could take it to a track day but I would feel like a bit of an idiot on a cruiser. Might take it to Sydney dragway one day but I am a rank amateur really on proper drag techniques, and would need a quick shifter fitted I think.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Summary of replying below ...

1, amazing single disk is competitive stopping power with the rest of the bikes ..... Maybe it is true, maybe not .... I always feel my old 1100cc jap bikes double disk had better stopping power ...

2, always wanted to mod my ECU but sending it by post would be risky ....

3, the 40° rake kit is super cool but the price is STUPID expensive, 2,800 without all the goodies attached .... Jackpot or Hammer same price

4, you have EBC brakes and lock your rear ? Please change the degree angle slightly of your foot brake .... No more locking after that ... 30% mate ...

5, yeah mate we got a few victory's here , no speed cameras, ride fast or slow,

6, rev (6400 rpm) or speed limiter kiks in at 200 km/h .... Gear 5 &6
The overdrive becomes a usable gear if you install a UnderDrive Pulley ...

Yes agree with VJ set your lever on #1 position and please check if your EBC brakepads are not glazed-up so to speak .... If you know what i mean .... Something to check ....

Also change your brake flued every 2 years ....
 
#31 ·
The grip of the front tire is the deciding factor for how well you can stop. The main reason for two discs up front is to help reduce brake fade. A single disc can stop you just fine.
I have never wanted for better brakes nor have I ever heat-faded the brakes... but I have EBC Pro-Lite rotors w/HH pads on both ends... and Z-rated radial tires too.
 
#28 ·
Yeah the fatter 130 Im now running up front has more braking force that the skinny 90 thats for sure.
And thats with the stock E3 that came with the wheel, I reckon a sticky tyre would be better again.
I know every time I fitted a new front tyre to the 21" it braked better than the almost worn out one I'd take off.
When descending a long steep hill I notice some riders ride thier brakes all the way down.
I prefer to go down under power and stop at the bottom as well as brief applications to wash off speed if theres bends.
On group rides 50-75% of riders are over-using thier brakes which is a pain in the ass following them.
I think some are just touching the lever for reassurance even.
 
#29 ·
My levers set to five cos of a hand injury, many years ago courtesy of way töo much wine, women, and my anger.
Its an easier lever and never bottoms out on the bars under heavy braking.
Suits me and my fucked up hand.
I really dont think lever setting makes any difference to retardation its a comfort setting.
JMHO
 
#38 ·
Just a matter of getting the right size steering head bearings Id think, inner dimension to suit the headstem of the triple clamps and outer to suit the frame diameter.
I wouldnt be surprised if it was a bolt up operation.
Had an XS1100 front firk assembly on an old K2 CB750/4 HONDA with twin discs, gave me slightly extended forks as a bonus.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BP6666VR
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top