Oil Blending - Victory Forums - Victory Motorcycle Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
post #1 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-23-2013, 06:00 PM Thread Starter
Site Sponsor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 275
Default Oil Blending

Although the basis here is Blending Synthetic and Mineral oils, further down applies to all oils.

The effect depends on the types of synthetic bases that were mixed with mineral bases. Polyalphaolefin and diester synthetic bases can be mixed with mineral oil bases, which is done regularly to create “blend” products.

Polyalkylene glycol (PAG) bases should not be mixed with any of the others unless specialized barrier fluids are used to minimize the incompatibility. When PAGs are mixed into other lubricants, you typically will get strong negative reactions (producing sludge and tacky residue) that require extra effort to flush, clean and correct.

Even if the base oils are compatible, there is the prospect that the additives used to create necessary performance properties could conflict, producing lost lubricant effectiveness.

It is advisable to perform filterability, oxidation stability, air release and demulsibility testing prior to mixing lubricant intentionally.

Remember, modern lubricants are sophisticated products, formulated to meet the demanding lubrication requirements of modern equipment. The old saying, “oil is oil” no longer applies. Mixing lubricants is fraught with danger — to your equipment, to your business and to your wallet. When in doubt, don’t mix different lubricants. If it occurs accidentally, address the problem immediately.

In its mildest form, mixing different lubricants may lead to a degradation of lubricant performance. Mixing the same API grades of synthetic passenger car motor oil and mineral oil-based engine oil won’t damage the engine, but you will lose the performance features you expect from the synthetic. At the other end of the spectrum, Deposits may form that could increase wear and plug filters.

Bob

Your AMSOIL Factory Connection Dealer Group offers special prices for Forum members and products are shipped from the closest AMSOIL warehouse.

For more info [email protected] or call Toll Free 1-877-356-6099.
Amsoil Dealer Group is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 01:05 AM
Senior Member
 
SilentUnicorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vermont
Posts: 580
Default

Guess I will not be mixing your oil with my oil.

m

'12 Vegas, 78 Bonneville, 69 BSA project.
SilentUnicorn is offline  
post #3 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 05:25 AM
Senior Member
 
TNXR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: East Tennessee
Posts: 2,268
Default

That amsoil must be some special oil!

2011 Cross Roads Sunset Red
OEM short windshield, passenger backrest, crash bars, saddle bag bars, heated grips, vinyl closeouts, tachometer, ambient temp, LED headlight, luggage rack. WD lay down licence plate.
TNXR is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 06:47 AM Thread Starter
Site Sponsor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 275
Default

There is no reference made to AMSOIL.

It goes for all oils.

You don't blend oils.


Bob

Your AMSOIL Factory Connection Dealer Group offers special prices for Forum members and products are shipped from the closest AMSOIL warehouse.

For more info [email protected] or call Toll Free 1-877-356-6099.
Amsoil Dealer Group is offline  
post #5 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 07:41 AM
Lifetime Premium
 
saddlebag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 5,632
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group View Post

Even if the base oils are compatible, there is the prospect that the additives used to create necessary performance properties could conflict, producing lost lubricant effectiveness.

In its mildest form, mixing different lubricants may lead to a degradation of lubricant performance. Mixing the same API grades of synthetic passenger car motor oil and mineral oil-based engine oil won’t damage the engine, but you will lose the performance features you expect from the synthetic. At the other end of the spectrum, Deposits may form that could increase wear and plug filters.

Bob
Can you cite an example of two oil additives that could "conflict" where the result is "lost lubricant effectiveness" or wear inducing "deposits?"




https://www.victoryforums.com/signaturepics/sigpic6903_1.gif
2011 Cross Roads
saddlebag is offline  
post #6 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 08:13 AM Thread Starter
Site Sponsor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 275
Default

Oil formulations today, are a careful balance of additives.

If a high concentration of an anti-wear agent is added to the oil,
the corrosion inhibitor may become less effective. The result may be an increase in corrosion-related problems.

Another example of additive balance would be Silicone. Silicone is used in some oils as an Anti-Foaming agent. Too little and it is ineffective, too much on the other hand will create foaming of the oil.

The whole point is: If you do't know exactly how each additive will effect another, you should not blend them. All oils are not built the same.

Just like medicines which is why they have a "Drug Interaction Chart"

Bob

Your AMSOIL Factory Connection Dealer Group offers special prices for Forum members and products are shipped from the closest AMSOIL warehouse.

For more info [email protected] or call Toll Free 1-877-356-6099.
Amsoil Dealer Group is offline  
post #7 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 08:49 AM
Lifetime Premium
 
saddlebag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 5,632
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group View Post
If a high concentration of an anti-wear agent is added to the oil,
the corrosion inhibitor may become less effective. The result may be an increase in corrosion-related problems.
So let's say Brand X has a 5% concentration of anti-wear agent and Brand Y has a 10% concentration. Mixing them 50/50 would yield a 7.5% concentration. Since this is a lower concentration than Brand Y alone, I can't see how it would effect the corrosion inhibitors. And they too would be averaged out in the mix.

Now I'll agree that perhaps brand Y is better than brand X at anti wear and mixing the two yields a solution that is less effective than brand Y alone, but it certainly isn't going to be any worse than brand X alone. And brand X is probably way better than good enough anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group View Post
Another example of additive balance would be Silicone. Silicone is used in some oils as an Anti-Foaming agent. Too little and it is ineffective, too much on the other hand will create foaming of the oil.
Same thing as above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group View Post
Just like medicines which is why they have a "Drug Interaction Chart"
To the contrary, medicines are different chemical concoctions that can react in a human body and cause unintended consequences. Oils are essentially the same. Sure one company uses a little more of this or that in their formulation, but it isn't like one is using acids and the other using bases that will neutralize and become water and salt.

I read and enjoyed your white paper on oils. And it does seem like yours is about as good a product as is out there. And I can see that adding some other lesser brand to your own might dilute some of the
benefits, but I can't think of anything that would interact to cause chemical reaction that would alter the oil into solids or neutralize an additive.

I've used numerous auto oil in a bunch of motorcycles that ran for tens of thousands of miles with no problems. Now is that as much protection as your brand? Prolly not. But did the engines seize up and die? Only once.

Actually, that engine was a Kawasaki ZRX1200 that shed a couple of its cylinder linings at 14k miles. I had them replated and ran it another 20k miles without any issues. And I continued to blend auto oils. I don't think the oil had anything to do with the shoddy plating that fell off.




https://www.victoryforums.com/signaturepics/sigpic6903_1.gif
2011 Cross Roads
saddlebag is offline  
post #8 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 10:37 AM Thread Starter
Site Sponsor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 275
Default

You are trying way to hard to justify this and assuming that all oils use the same additives.

"But did the engines seize up and die? Only once." Once isn't enough? You do not have the testing facilities to make the stand "I never had a problem" or to be able to tell what is actually happening inside of the engine.

There are more than 1 or 2 additives compounded to do a certain job and there is a fine balance to make them work.

An oil can contain upwards of 25% additives to have it perform the task at hand. An engine will not survive for long if an oil with no additives is used.

Oil Blending is a science which is best left to the professionals.

Bob

Your AMSOIL Factory Connection Dealer Group offers special prices for Forum members and products are shipped from the closest AMSOIL warehouse.

For more info [email protected] or call Toll Free 1-877-356-6099.

Last edited by Amsoil Dealer Group; 01-24-2013 at 10:47 AM.
Amsoil Dealer Group is offline  
post #9 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 10:46 AM Thread Starter
Site Sponsor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 275
Default

"To the contrary, medicines are different chemical concoctions that can react in a human body and cause unintended consequences. Oils are essentially the same."

I guess we have a problem with comprehension. This is not the 60's or 70's as that statement is far from beng true.

By your statement, you can use the same oil in a 2008 Diesel pickup as a 2006 Diesel pickup with the same engine as long as it is the 15W-40 spec.

Bob

Your AMSOIL Factory Connection Dealer Group offers special prices for Forum members and products are shipped from the closest AMSOIL warehouse.

For more info [email protected] or call Toll Free 1-877-356-6099.
Amsoil Dealer Group is offline  
post #10 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-24-2013, 10:56 AM
Lifetime Premium
 
saddlebag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 5,632
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group View Post
"But did the engines seize up and die? Only once." Once isn't enough?
Actually, now that I think about it, it was twice. The plating on my chrome rockers flaked off on my Ducati too. That was a well known problem with those outsourced parts and Ducati covered all expenses of replacing them even though it happened a year or more after my two year warranty had expired. They were a stand up company in every respect IMHO.

The issue on the Kaw happened just after the warranty had expired and they absolved themselves of any responsibility. Still, I could have the entire engine overhauled on that thing for less than the cost of Victory chrome gremlin bell.




https://www.victoryforums.com/signaturepics/sigpic6903_1.gif
2011 Cross Roads
saddlebag is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Victory Forums - Victory Motorcycle Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome