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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 11:48 AM Thread Starter
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Default CCT Fit & Finish

I had a chance to attend the International Motorcycle Show over the weekend where I could get some time looking over the CCT. I think I visited the Victory area 5 times! In comparison, I felt the HD Ultra was a good comparison model. I liked the CCT very much, but some of it made me feel like I'd be settling over some other manufacturers.

I am curious about thoughts on some of the what seems to be issues with not well thought out "completeness" of the CCT. Things such as the switch pods and wires that hang down from the molded parts of the throttle and clutch bar ends. Or the rear brake master cylinder and reservoir that are in the open. The rear brake pedal that felt flimsy and loose. The exposed clutch end where it goes into the transmission. And the front "grill" that looks like it was an afterthought to cut it with a jigsaw to make room for the exhaust pipe.

I know these may be minor, but it seems like Victory did not put forth the the effort to complete these properly and leaves the bike feeling somewhat like these were afterthoughts added on or left undone to get the bike into production. At least these should have been addressed on later model years.

The HD on the other hand was very "complete" and everything seemed to fit with what I would expect for a $23k + motorcycle. I realize there is a huge difference in $'s available for product development between these two companies, but to me these could be a deal breaker.
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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 12:19 PM
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I agree with you to a certain extent. A Road Glide Ultra was my other choice. I went with the Vic after a long test ride on each, back to back. Also, I have a good friend who owns a very good indy HD shop. That combined with my previous HD experience help me choose.

The HD offers the best paint and chrome in the business. Very robust materials and attention to detail. However, their design is still poor in some areas. We still have cam chain tensioner issues, a poor oiling system, excessive blow by at sustained highway speeds, and sufficient vibration to make all the stuff that fit when new, fall of the bike as you tool down that stretch of 50 highway in Nevada. The isolation of the motor and suspension make vibration apparently go away while you are riding, but it's there.

Knowing all this did not keep me from considering the HD. It's a very complete touring solution, no doubt. And the above issues are easily fixed, but costly. After spending 23-25k on a HD, I'm not eager to spend another 2.5 to 5 k on fixing it in the first year or two.

I think the Vic has a far better mechanical design in so many areas, and that was more important to me than finish.

2013 Cross Country Tour
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 12:37 PM
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There's an old saying; Beauty is only skin deep.

2010 Midnight Cherry XR. 7Jurock, Lloydz AF, ATS, AFR tuned VFCIII, IAV, and T-6 and locally repacked pipes = big smiles. SOLD to a dear friend, so it's still in the family."
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 12:41 PM
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to me it comes down to two things,something you can ride
and rely on,or something you can polish and admire the
shiny bits..

KURYAKYN LED BLINKERS
GUNFIGHTER SEAT
KURYAKYN FLAME COMFORTGRIPS
KURYAKYN FLAME PEGS
"JACKPOT" OIL COOLER COVER
CHROME STARTER COVER
MEMPHIS SHADES WINDSHIELD
VICTORY TOOL ROLL
RPW SLASH EXHAUST
S&S INTAKE
KURYAKYN ELLIPSE MIRRORS
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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 01:02 PM
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Some I agree on and some is just taste.

There are some shortcomings on the XCT, most of them aren't what you mentioned. The controls is a black eye. They are iffy as to the ergos and weatherproofing. Speaking of that, the weatherproofing is iffy on some. I haven't had problems, but the cruise, radio switches have been a point of concern when water hits them. There have also been reports of condensation in the weather head on the radio itself. Not all have issues, but they are out there.

The brake pedal is a matter of some hot topics, however, it works well and really is a solid piece. Some have noted play in the levers for the brake and clutch and it is a cheap fix, but shouldn't need to be. No problems in that department for me either.

The reservoir, well it is just what it is. Not sure where HD puts theirs but the Vic is easy to service, and it does need service every year or two, and really a non issue for most. In fact Victory is a VERY easy to service bike as compared to almost anything out there. If you don't like it dress it up and roll on, same for the cam tension bolt covers.

The clutch, well there is a cover for that too, but I think on a high price machine it should have been hydraulic. I am not really fond of it and think it is kinda cheezy but it makes for easy service so not all a loss.

Not sure about the grill. I guess since I don't notice it, it isn't a problem for me. Besides it is hard to see from the seat, so no worries. LOL

Paint is a bit soft when new, or was, and some have griped about that. Wiring really needed to be a notch heavier IMHO, but guess it is adequate.

Latches are old school and work well. Wish it had a central lock for all the bags, but oh well no real biggie.

If the HD is what you want, go for it. I'd be on one if the math wasn't so fuzzy. I'm on the fence if I will have another Vic, mostly because of my dealer. Wait!! The dealers are the reason I don't own a HD,,,,,,hmmmmm.

Victory's are about as good a rider as I've ever been on. My last 3 bikes were 2 Ventures and a GW, so I have ridden some good ones. It has some really concerning potential problems, but none that I've dealt with yet.

Happy Shopping

Some people go their whole life wondering if they made a difference, Marines don't have that problem.~ Ronald Reagan

2012 XCT, AFR+ Gen 4, Lloydz air filter. I don't equate noise with power.
I ride with the Force.
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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 01:27 PM
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L-I-T: well said.

Cheers,

Bill P.

2012 XCT (SOLD) : HeliBars; Centramatics; PC-V; Lloydz air filter; 11" Madstad; Rivco LED mirrors; Doran TPMS; Stebel horn; Motolights; CustomLED trunk flasher; KewlHeel shifter; CycleOps trunk rack; BeadRider seat; Vibranator bar ends; Passenger grab handles; Powerlet outlets; Handlebar RAM mount; RicZ laydown plate; Brukus SaddlebagSecure; 14" flexible antenna; RAM cupholder on trunk; shock Schrader valve relocation.

Gallery: http://www.billanddot.com/victory-xct/
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostintexas View Post
The reservoir, well it is just what it is. Not sure where HD puts theirs but the Vic is easy to service, and it does need service every year or two, and really a non issue for most. In fact Victory is a VERY easy to service bike as compared to almost anything out there. If you don't like it dress it up and roll on, same for the cam tension bolt covers.
A couple ears back, a forum member put out these reservoir covers. I don't remember who it was and I haven't seen these pop up since. Maybe someone would like to step up to this plate?
I have since lost the cover as it was glued on the OEM cap and apparently the glue did not hold. But the OEM cap looks just fine, so the sleeve part is all one really needs. I think the sleeve affords protection from rock hits too.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Reservoir Cover 1.jpg (36.6 KB, 24 views)

2010 Midnight Cherry XR. 7Jurock, Lloydz AF, ATS, AFR tuned VFCIII, IAV, and T-6 and locally repacked pipes = big smiles. SOLD to a dear friend, so it's still in the family."
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Last edited by RICZ; 02-03-2014 at 01:35 PM.
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock Woody View Post
...snip...

The HD on the other hand was very "complete" and everything seemed to fit with what I would expect for a $23k + motorcycle. I realize there is a huge difference in $'s available for product development between these two companies, but to me these could be a deal breaker.
Oh, heck, I'll chime in.

About fit and finish, I mostly agree.

It's all what you're looking for in a bike.

After visiting Vic dealers and the Vic area at the NYC show a couple of years, I actually grew to like the Vision. When it first came out, I thought it was too Buck Rodgers for my taste. However, when I compared the room in the Vision's topcase and -- especially -- saddlebags with the XCT, well, THAT was a deal breaker for me (and so I bought the XCT). When I do multi-day trips with my wife, we need all the room we can get. I suppose I could buy a trailer for those trips, but I don't want to spend that money just yet. My point? Deal breakers come in all kinds of flavors.

I owned a Valkyrie Interstate for seven years, and spent a couple of thousand on aftermarket shiny bits. And that's out of my system now.

I ride all sorts of Harleys every year at Americade (which is less than an hour north of where I live). I really like the fact that HD lets you take the bikes out on your own for the demo rides (except for the V-Rods). And I have a Harley dealer about five minutes from my house. (A Vic dealer is about 20 minutes away, but I bought my XCT about 160 miles away -- different story).

However, I never felt really comfortable on an HD. I'm not a big guy -- 5'9", 30" inseam -- but I felt cramped on even the biggest Harleys. The floorboard length is way longer on the XCT. I know, you can get highway pegs, but I don't need to on the Vic, and so my feet are never that far away from the controls.

If you do your own maint, having to put oil in two places on the HDs could be a deal breaker. The Vic is great for DIY maint... except for the fuel filter and air filter.

Handling and ground clearance is much better on the Vics. If you're a fan of serious twisties, that could be a deal breaker against getting an HD.

IMHO, Harleys are more finished and polished, and have better paint. The Motor Company has had a long time to perfect that stuff, and it shows. They've had a long time to perfect their engines, and it doesn't show. Go figure.

I'm not particularly fond of the cables and switchgear on the Vics, or of the rear master cylinder, or how you add air to the rear shock on the XCTs. Or Vic's dropping the HID for the '13 and '14 XCTs. Or how you can't bring the bars back on an XCT using just risers. Or the slop in my shift lever; I bought new OEM sleeves for that a few weeks ago, and will put them on before riding season starts for me.

But after two seasons and 18,000+ miles, the XCT has been stone cold reliable for me, and handles great on the highway and in the twisties. And has a very low C of G and let's me easily flat-foot it at stops; those are the primary reasons I got rid of my Valkyrie after seven seasons, i.e., that was yet another flavor of deal breaker.

So, yes, you're right, the HDs probably do a better job in the fit-and-finish department. But in order to come up with a deal breaker, you have to ask yourself what's critical to you in a bike, how do you use it, and so forth. If it's fit-and-finish, hard to go wrong with a Harley.

Cheers,

Bill P.

2012 XCT (SOLD) : HeliBars; Centramatics; PC-V; Lloydz air filter; 11" Madstad; Rivco LED mirrors; Doran TPMS; Stebel horn; Motolights; CustomLED trunk flasher; KewlHeel shifter; CycleOps trunk rack; BeadRider seat; Vibranator bar ends; Passenger grab handles; Powerlet outlets; Handlebar RAM mount; RicZ laydown plate; Brukus SaddlebagSecure; 14" flexible antenna; RAM cupholder on trunk; shock Schrader valve relocation.

Gallery: http://www.billanddot.com/victory-xct/
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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock Woody View Post
I had a chance to attend the International Motorcycle Show over the weekend where I could get some time looking over the CCT. I think I visited the Victory area 5 times! In comparison, I felt the HD Ultra was a good comparison model. I liked the CCT very much, but some of it made me feel like I'd be settling over some other manufacturers.

I am curious about thoughts on some of the what seems to be issues with not well thought out "completeness" of the CCT. Things such as the switch pods and wires that hang down from the molded parts of the throttle and clutch bar ends. Or the rear brake master cylinder and reservoir that are in the open. The rear brake pedal that felt flimsy and loose. The exposed clutch end where it goes into the transmission. And the front "grill" that looks like it was an afterthought to cut it with a jigsaw to make room for the exhaust pipe.

I know these may be minor, but it seems like Victory did not put forth the the effort to complete these properly and leaves the bike feeling somewhat like these were afterthoughts added on or left undone to get the bike into production. At least these should have been addressed on later model years.

The HD on the other hand was very "complete" and everything seemed to fit with what I would expect for a $23k + motorcycle. I realize there is a huge difference in $'s available for product development between these two companies, but to me these could be a deal breaker.
I think Harley is hard to beat when it comes to fit & finish. But, you only told us the things you found on the Vic. We all want to be proud of our bikes but there is more to it than fit & finish. Nothing on the Ultra? Except for the VRod, all Harleys look like classics that they have looked like for many years. Look at where the oil filters are located and why you have to slop oil over the Harley engine everytime you change it. They have had a lot of years to come up with a better design that that. The price of oil changes. Engine issues...
Bottom line - we are still looking for the perfect bike.

Randy
2011 Cross Country "Mistress", Imperial Blue, Stage1
2010 Kingpin "Pin" Midnight Cherry
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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 09:23 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone. All very good comments and it sounds like what I was seeing is in many cases what it is. The Victory could use more attention to detail, but is nonetheless very functional and an excellent motorcycle.

I was hoping that the show would confirm my decision to purchase a leftover 2013 using the $1k show special off of any Victory. I guess I'll have to wait until warmer weather so I can rent a new CCT and a HD Ultra to see which is the right bike for me.
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