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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 10:01 AM Thread Starter
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I got one from some company Vic was using to gather info. It was basically a test of what features and types of bikes I liked best. Apparently, they must feel that Americans aren't capable of simply describing what they want in English, so they made a picture show to select from.

Anyway, I think they were trying to get some marketing info on their Indian as that was a model frequently shown.

What I found interesting was that the engine that the last owners went to such lengths to create with its gorgeous cylindrical heads was gone.



In its place appeared to be an X-Wedge engine with custom head covers to make it look a little like some old fin topped engine. Here's an X-Wedge with standard head covers:



The rest of the Indians shown looked pretty much the same as what was sold before the Victory acquisition.

I've read that the X-Wedge is supposed to be a nice engine, but it isn't as purdy as the last one. And why have a bike like that if not to look purdy?




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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 11:13 AM
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Polaris bought Indian to waist there money is my thinking.
Indian hasn't been a good seller for the last ten years so why in the world did they buy it.
Not for its looks I'm sure.

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 12:58 PM
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I might be wrong but... I think they bought Indian to fight the Harley "heritage" argument. Now Polaris can say they have the newest and oldest American Motorcycle. I guess technically that may be true but for me there really isn't a tie from the post 1953 Indians to the original.

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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 01:20 PM
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It is ok I just never really liked Indiana that much. Here in Fairmount Indiana on James Dean festival The Indian was a big deal back in the 50's and the old Mercuries which they still portray every September at the end of the month. Hundreds of motorcycles from all over come to town at 1pm on Sunday to the cemetery at his grave site. Hundreds of old cruisers, Mercuries, and vintage cars are in a week long car shows..Pretty neat traffic gets bad some times..

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 01:21 PM
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Well, let's not forget that Polaris bought and probably saved Victory as Vic wasn't doing all that hot and if I recall correctly was nearly bankrupt. So, who's to say that Polaris doesn't have some really cool ideas on how to make Indian into something amazing?! I have some faith in them, they did make the Victory brand stronger, and it will be interesting to see where they take the Indian brand.

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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 01:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marius View Post
Well, let's not forget that Polaris bought and probably saved Victory as Vic wasn't doing all that hot and if I recall correctly was nearly bankrupt. So, who's to say that Polaris doesn't have some really cool ideas on how to make Indian into something amazing?! I have some faith in them, they did make the Victory brand stronger, and it will be interesting to see where they take the Indian brand.
According to this, Victory was always a Polaris brand:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victory_Motorcycles




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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 02:19 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by visionjohnny View Post
Polaris bought Indian to waist there money is my thinking.
Indian hasn't been a good seller for the last ten years so why in the world did they buy it.
Not for its looks I'm sure.
I don't think executives take on projects to lose money, but I have to agree that I don't see a good strategy here. They already sell a top notch cruiser line, why spend the huge money to market a cutesy competing brand that will cannibalize sales of the existing brand? The fantastic brand that makes power, handles, is comfortable and reliable, that is...

Why not just develop an overpriced line of tassels for the Victories to lure in the fashionable MoCo faithful and be done with it?




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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marius View Post
Well, let's not forget that Polaris bought and probably saved Victory as Vic wasn't doing all that hot and if I recall correctly was nearly bankrupt. So, who's to say that Polaris doesn't have some really cool ideas on how to make Indian into something amazing?! I have some faith in them, they did make the Victory brand stronger, and it will be interesting to see where they take the Indian brand.
Ahh, Polaris MADE victory from scratch they didn't buy it

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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 03:51 PM
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I just completed a survey from Clarity Research. They showed 17 different bikes. They showed versions that I didn't know about. Prototypes? It only took 10 mins. If you get the chance give it a try.

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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 06-02-2012, 04:30 PM
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As some have pointed out, Victory has always been a Polaris-owned company. They did have some problems with engines (or was it transmissions) back in the early days (V92s) but I don't think that ever jeopardized the company.

Seems obvious that they bought Indian for the name and to have a direct competitor to the "legacy look" that seems to (artificially) prop up Harley. Polaris probably said "We could develop a Victory that looks old but that would take away the cutting-edge styling that makes a Victory well, a Victory for a 1/2 gazillion $'s or we could simply buy Indian for pennies on the dollar and utilize our experience and built-in efficiencies to bring the Indian line back into profitability."

Someone stated that the prior owners spent a lot of time & $'s on the prior engine.... and then nearly went bankrupt because the bikes ended up being priced too high for the market. The FIRST thing Polaris probably did was to set aside that particular "mistake" and move the engine to a more reliable and FAR less-costly engine to build, maintain and keep running. If they want to put some cosmetics on them that helps them retain that "legacy" look, the more power to them.

If you like modern, you won't like Indian (because it's too traditional). If you can appreciate tradition, you won't like Victory (because it's too modern). The Indian bikes are about 2 inches longer than the Victory Vision. This makes them ride even smoother that the Vision bikes. In person the '09 and newer Indian Cheif's are absolutely BEAUTIFUL motorcycles. Unfortunately, they were simply priced beyond what most people buying a traditional bike are either willing or capable of paying ($35K plus) for that privilege.

Offer a Chief without all the chrome for around $19K or $20K (Max) that can directly compete with the H-D Road King. Then offer the chrome add-on baubles to it along with a healthy markup into the $35K+ CVO pricing territory. You will have a longer bike that rides FAR smoother than ANY Harley. If the engine looks traditional but doesn't require expensive maintenance, you will have the H-D owners that detest the modern Victory styling beating a path to your door in an effort to get away from Harley.

Merchandising - Many Victory owners gripe (justifiably) about the lack of clothing. Polaris probably thought about beefing that area up but thought "if we are going to sink $'s into clothing, Indian clothing may be a more sensible brand to make that investment in.

Note: In 2 years pull this post back up and see how accurate my predictions may have become in those years. I did apply for that marketing job @ Indian but nobody ever called me about that application so that probably means that everything I outlined here is what will happen because.... great minds think alike, right?




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