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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 06:25 PM Thread Starter
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Default XBike performance review/options

Well, I've been trying to get a dyno graph like this going for a while now. This graph shows all the common mods that are available for the XC to date (minus stock bore high-comp pistons which I believe is a waste of time/money).

Don't get wrapped up in the final numbers, look at the graphs and compare. After running a bunch of different XC's I believe these are very common numbers. Yes I know some of you out there may be making more, bla, bla, bla, but you are the minority in my experience. So pay attention to how the graphs compare and that is a good indication of how the bike will run as compared to other engine mods.

I have highlighted the STG1 graph for clarity, then you can see the "Just VM1 cams" followed by my 110" recipe, then the 116". All these are using Lloyds cams and pistons where indicated, and all were built by me and run on the same dyno.

Enjoy and start the bench racing!
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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 06:28 PM Thread Starter
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A couple of notes to get the juices flowing: Note the hit below 3000rpms that "just cams" makes as opposed to STG1.

Also note the Lloyds 6400 REV ECU on the 110" and 116". A PCV revving to 6000 would also work with all these combos.

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vicbuilder View Post
Well, I've been trying to get a dyno graph like this going for a while now. This graph shows all the common mods that are available for the XC to date (minus stock bore high-comp pistons which I believe is a waste of time/money).

Don't get wrapped up in the final numbers, look at the graphs and compare. After running a bunch of different XC's I believe these are very common numbers. Yes I know some of you out there may be making more, bla, bla, bla, but you are the minority in my experience. So pay attention to how the graphs compare and that is a good indication of how the bike will run as compared to other engine mods.

I have highlighted the STG1 graph for clarity, then you can see the "Just VM1 cams" followed by my 110" recipe, then the 116". All these are using Lloyds cams and pistons where indicated, and all were built by me and run on the same dyno.

Enjoy and start the bench racing!
Thanks for the info, but it may be easier to read if you break it out into separate data sheets.

It looks to me like the highlighted Stage 1 (orange) plot is of its HP and the highlighted 110 (red) plot is of its torque curve. Comparing the two don't mean much.

The other colors are too vague for me to figure out what goes with what. Sorry to be critical, but this is dandy information that I'd just love to digest.




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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 07:32 PM Thread Starter
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Red and orange are tq and hp of a stg1 bike as stated. Graphs are overlaid for compartive purposes, i belive 4 different graphs makes it harder to compare because you have to jump from one graph to another to another, etc. This puts it in perspective. Sux that this site makes the pic so small though, even clicking it doesnt make it much bigger.

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 08:21 PM
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Red and orange are tq and hp of a stg1 bike as stated.
I see. They just don't match the color code on the chart.

So looking at the Stage 1, below 3k rpms it is making more power than the next lowest torque curve, which would presumably be "Just Cams." This would seem to contradict your follow-up statement, hence my initial confusion.

They do give it a nice top end boost though.

1. So is the "Just Cams" using the stock exhaust baffles and airbox or Stage 1 versions?

2. Do you have to add a Power Commander or equivalent or is there a way to directly flash the bike's ECM or was this data taken with a stock or Stage 1 map?

3. How much do you charge for such a job? How long does it take?




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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 08:24 PM
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Guessing the 110 is VM1, and the 116 is VM1HP

I'm not an asshole...I just type that way
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 10:16 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saddlebag View Post
I see. They just don't match the color code on the chart.

So looking at the Stage 1, below 3k rpms it is making more power than the next lowest torque curve, which would presumably be "Just Cams." This would seem to contradict your follow-up statement, hence my initial confusion.

They do give it a nice top end boost though.

1. So is the "Just Cams" using the stock exhaust baffles and airbox or Stage 1 versions?

2. Do you have to add a Power Commander or equivalent or is there a way to directly flash the bike's ECM or was this data taken with a stock or Stage 1 map?

3. How much do you charge for such a job? How long does it take?
When I said it took a hit, I mean the STG1 bike make more power and tq below 3K than the "just cammed" bike. So yes we are both saying the same thing.

All bikes are running slip-ons with unmodified head pipes and unmodified cats, and I believe that by some twist of fate they are all running the Honkers if I remember correctly (not necessarily on purpose). All bikes are running the Victory STG1 reusable air filter.

STG1 bike is just a reflash, cammed bike is a VFC, big-bore bikes are PCV.

Prices depend on what you have and what you want, but start about $1200 for just cams and up to $6000ish for a nice 116".


And yes Kevin you are correct, VM1 in the 110" and VM1HP in the 116".

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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 05:53 AM
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When I said it took a hit, I mean the STG1 bike make more power and tq below 3K than the "just cammed" bike. So yes we are both saying the same thing.

All bikes are running slip-ons with unmodified head pipes and unmodified cats, and I believe that by some twist of fate they are all running the Honkers if I remember correctly (not necessarily on purpose). All bikes are running the Victory STG1 reusable air filter.

STG1 bike is just a reflash, cammed bike is a VFC, big-bore bikes are PCV.

Prices depend on what you have and what you want, but start about $1200 for just cams and up to $6000ish for a nice 116".


And yes Kevin you are correct, VM1 in the 110" and VM1HP in the 116".
Thanks.

For the uninitiated, can you describe a VFC and a PCV. Speaking in acronyms is fine around the shop, but for the laymen out here, such jargon is of no value.

I have a feeling the PCV is not a positive crankcase ventilation, but a Power Commander V (PCV). A VFC sounds like an Asian knock off of a chicken joint to me. Anyway, is it safe to assume the cost of these are rolled up in the prices you listed?

I was still curious on a time frame for the work. Many people coming to see you will be traveling. Knowing how long they may have to wait there is an important consideration.

Finally, since the work would obviously void the mfg warranty, do you offer one of your own?




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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 06:33 AM
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Hmmmmmmmm need to try a 110 with HP CAMS

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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 08:36 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Thanks.

For the uninitiated, can you describe a VFC and a PCV. Speaking in acronyms is fine around the shop, but for the laymen out here, such jargon is of no value.

I have a feeling the PCV is not a positive crankcase ventilation, but a Power Commander V (PCV). A VFC sounds like an Asian knock off of a chicken joint to me. Anyway, is it safe to assume the cost of these are rolled up in the prices you listed?

I was still curious on a time frame for the work. Many people coming to see you will be traveling. Knowing how long they may have to wait there is an important consideration.

Finally, since the work would obviously void the mfg warranty, do you offer one of your own?


Yes, PCV is a Power Commander 5, and a VFC is a Victory Fuel Controller, two of the most popular fuel controllers on the market and the subject of hundreds of posts/debates over the years.

Timeframe, again, depends on what you have and what you want. A set of cams can be done in an afternoon. A 116" could take 6-8 weeks if you didn't want to use my core cylinders. Typically though extensive engine work I like to slate 1-2 weeks to allow for enought time to not rush the job, and proper break-in (assuming we have all the parts collected in advance).

Lastly like any good mechanic, my work is warrantied. If I messed something up I will fix it. On the other hand if you sprayed the nitrous on a cold motor at 2000 rpms, that is on you (trust me, I'll be able to tell)!

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