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Discussion Starter #1
It's been a while since I used a Victory brand oil filter. If anyone has one on the shelf, could I get a measurement? I'm interested in the length or height (depending on your point of view) of the stocker, as shown in the attached view of a K&N filter (which filters I've been using for the last three or four oil changes). The K&N is about 3.52", as shown in the pic, minus the built-in nut that K&Ns have.

Working on a potential (or more likely soon-to-be-abandoned) project, and I'm interested in potential swingarm clearance issues.

Thanks.
 

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I know you asked for stock oil filter but was in garage and checked my Wix just so you could have more information.
Came up with 3.5"
Am thinking where the filter will be close to the swing arm would not pivot down ward un less you un hooked the shock or raised the bike off the ground.
To me if you hit a pot hole or bump the swing arm will pivot up ward not down. As long as the tire is on the ground the swing arm can't move down ward.
You could plug the holes in the adapter put a spare filter in bag with wrench and take a ride to see. I checked the parts book and we have the same swing arm.
Hope I have helped you
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Hmm, you wouldn't be working on an adapter to allow the use of more common and dirt cheap car filters would you?
Sorry, nope.

I was planning on putting an "oil filter sandwich" back there, in between the engine and the oil filter. See the end of this thread -- http://www.victoryforums.com/showthread.php?t=85729 -- which also references another thread.

In fact, I already bought the sandwich and some other parts. Yesterday, I crawled under the bike, and closely examined things. As the bike sits on the floor (in a Wheeldock chock -- see http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-wheel-chock/wheeldock-review/ ), there is clearance for the sandwich + filter. The sandwich I bought is 1.03" wide, plus the width of a partially compressed O-ring.

That's OK as I was looking at the bike, but it appears that the swingarm will get perilously close to the end of the filter if the bike gets airborne, i.e., if the shock is extended downward much. I don't have a bike lift of any sort, so I can't tell how much closer. I was hoping that the Vic filter might be at least 1/2" (or more) shorter, in which case my project might still be on track.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I know you asked for stock oil filter but was in garage and checked my Wix just so you could have more information.
Came up with 3.5"
Am thinking where the filter will be close to the swing arm would not pivot down ward un less you un hooked the shock or raised the bike off the ground.
To me if you hit a pot hole or bump the swing arm will pivot up ward not down. As long as the tire is on the ground the swing arm can't move down ward.
You could plug the holes in the adapter put a spare filter in bag with wrench and take a ride to see. I checked the parts book and we have the same swing arm.
Hope I have helped you
VJ: thank you very much -- yep, your thoughts have helped, and thanks for the measurement of the Wix.

I realize that we don't ride the Cross bikes on too many motocross tracks and that sort of thing, but you never know when some biggish dip in the road will cause the back end to get very light, especially taken at high speed.

Yep, all bets are off if you disconnect the shock.

I'm thinking that the next time I have the bike in a shop -- say, for a new rear tire, or something -- I'll ask to have the rear platform support dropped out of the way, and see what the swingarm does in that area.
 

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Bill when your out ridding and hit a bump or rail road tracks keep a ear out for the rear tire coming off the ground.
Unless you road fast off a curb I can't see any way the wheel would ever come off the ground so the swing arm would never go down. Guess it would if you had a flat tire.
 

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Cresting a frost heave or similar feature in the road at speed could easily result in the suspension extending. There's a road that I've been playing with since the day I got my license that has a great set of "rollercoaster" hills. On the vic the suspension is definitely stretching out as I crest them. On my other bikes.... well lets just say I've used ALL the suspension travel on more than one occaision.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Cresting a frost heave or similar feature in the road at speed could easily result in the suspension extending. There's a road that I've been playing with since the day I got my license that has a great set of "rollercoaster" hills. On the vic the suspension is definitely stretching out as I crest them. On my other bikes.... well lets just say I've used ALL the suspension travel on more than one occaision.
Yeah, I was thinking something along those same lines. Soofle, you happen to have a stock Vic filter you could get a measurement on (see first post)?
 

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As a general rule of thumb, oil filters come in two sizes. 2.5 in and 3.25 in. Of course this will vary to a degree, but it sounds like your K&N is of the longer variety. As for the "stock" size, I believe it to be the shorter version.
Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #10
As a general rule of thumb, oil filters come in two sizes. 2.5 in and 3.25 in. Of course this will vary to a degree, but it sounds like your K&N is of the longer variety. As for the "stock" size, I believe it to be the shorter version.
Cheers
Thanks, LostinTX. Looks like a road trip is in order for me, to the nearest Vic dealer, so I can go verify your conclusion (and then buy the filter).

K&N says "Height: 3.313 in (84 mm)" for their KN-198 ( http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?prod=KN-198 ), which is the proper filter for the Cross bikes (according to their fitment page, www.knfilters.com/search/appsearch.aspx ). Maybe their measuring technique doesn't include the gasket or the reinforcement under the nut or something, because you can see how I took my measurement in that first pic.

If the Vic filter is really about an inch shorter than the K&Ns that I've been using for the last few oil changes, then I'm back in business, putting that 1" extension on.
 

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I prefer the longer variety when I can get them, just because there is more media and surface area to filter. I may be a bit OCD in that and here lately am becoming a bit less so.
I'm sure the shorter are fine.
So are you going to let us in on the secret, or did I already miss the project particulars?

Cheers

OK, I did miss it. Not sure of the reasoning, but we all have our projects. Hope it works out and you accomplish what your are looking for.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
...
OK, I did miss it. Not sure of the reasoning, but we all have our projects. Hope it works out and you accomplish what your are looking for.
For several reasons -- none of them earth-shattering or really even necessary -- I decided I'd like a digital oil temperature meter added to my '12 XCT (which is, IMHO, woefully lacking in engine information).

In any case and to that end, I've already purchased: the meter; an enclosure for the meter (necessary because it's a panel mount, and I want a handlebar mount); the oil filter sandwich (for the meter's probe); an adapter (required because the sandwich's female openings do not match the probe's male threads); some high-temp insulation sheathing; and a few odds and ends.

I decided upon a sandwich because I didn't want to permanently alter -- read "damage" -- the bike in any way, such as getting out my tap and die set. Some H-D riders add a gauge by adding a T to an existing oil pressure sensor port, but on my XCT that area is lacking in room, covered by an ABS line, and so forth. [Edit addition: I forgot to mention that I'm also aware that there are systems that have a sensor replace an oil drain plug, but I don't want anything hanging down from the bottom of the bike, possibly subject to damage from speed bumps, etc.]

That left a sandwich. But then (yes, somewhat late in the project) I discovered the potential swingarm clearance issue. If Vic's recommended oil filter is an inch less than the K&Ns I've been using without incident, then I'm OK, i.e., Vic + sandwich = K&N.

I'm a little disappointed that someone doesn't have a Vic filter sitting on a shelf, waiting to be used for the next oil change, and can just measure it for me. I'm not asking anyone to crawl on the floor and actually measure an in-use Vic filter.

That's the whole story. If I get this to work -- and several forum members have expressed interest in other threads in this -- I'll do a full write-up, with parts list, pictures, instructions, and commentary. If you're bored and want to look at my prior XCT project write-ups:

http://www.billanddot.com/customled-brake-light-flasher.html
http://www.billanddot.com/shock-valve-relocation.html
http://www.billanddot.com/adding-rivco-led-mirrors.html
 

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Bill why not measure your filter and adapter as a unit. Now take a peace of cardboard that length and tape it to the filter you have now and ride. Just keep a eye on it for and damage to the cardboard and that might tell you if you would ever damage your new set up
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Hi Bill, I have the Vic filter on my bike, I will measure it when I get home in about 3 hours and send you a picture.
Thanks much, Paul.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Bill why not measure your filter and adapter as a unit. Now take a peace of cardboard that length and tape it to the filter you have now and ride. Just keep a eye on it for and damage to the cardboard and that might tell you if you would ever damage your new set up
VJ: Yep, a possibility. I thought about putting some Play-Doh or something like that on the end, but I figure it would fall off. I also have the problem that maybe I wouldn't encounter all the potholes, frost heaves, etc., in a test run that I might encounter later on someday.
 

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WOW, that is an answer. LOL
Sorry, I'd have been no help even if at home. I have a filter sitting on the shelf but it is definitely of the longer variety. It isn't a Vic filter either.

Well, I have to ask now. With all this new information, what are you going to do with it or about it. We already know the engines run hottish. We already know how to cool it off. If a fuel tuner isn't in your future,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Where is too hot? What can be done other than shutting down to cool it if needed? Will you shut down in the middle of no where if a gauge tells you that you passed a magical number (is there a magical number)? I don't think these engines get hot enough to actually boil the oil, which would be very bad for the bike and the rider, so what gives?

I can live with "not getting it", but just wondering if you had some sort of insight.

Good Luck
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
WOW, that is an answer. LOL
Sorry, I'd have been no help even if at home. I have a filter sitting on the shelf but it is definitely of the longer variety. It isn't a Vic filter either.

Well, I have to ask now. With all this new information, what are you going to do with it or about it. We already know the engines run hottish. We already know how to cool it off. If a fuel tuner isn't in your future,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Where is too hot? What can be done other than shutting down to cool it if needed? Will you shut down in the middle of no where if a gauge tells you that you passed a magical number (is there a magical number)? I don't think these engines get hot enough to actually boil the oil, which would be very bad for the bike and the rider, so what gives?

I can live with "not getting it", but just wondering if you had some sort of insight.

Good Luck
Indeed I do:

1) I switched, two oil changes ago, to Royal Purple. I don't want to discuss whether synthetic is better than canola oil or even deep-fried lard -- no oil thread, please. However, RP claims that it lowers engine temp; see http://www.royalpurpleconsumer.com/products/max-cycle-motorcycle-engine-oil/ . I would occasionally point a laser thermometer at the jug fins after a ride, both before and after my oil switch. RP seemed to lower temps (although much less than they claimed) vs. whatever co. Vic uses, but my testing method sucks: way too many variables. Be nice to have something better for those kinds of tests.

2) I will be going to Lloyd's, a couple hours south of me, this summer, to have a fuel controller and air filter installed, and a tune. As I already discussed with Lloyd (via a visit to his shop last year and email this year), this is all to have the Vic run cooler, not for any performance reasons. I'm curious if the oil temp will go down, although I recognize that most of the reduction in heat will probably be in terms of the exhaust gases, not (necessarily) the oil temp.

So, I can measure at least this aspect of oil (and I already use Blackstone for the real oil testing), and a tuner's in my future. I'm not going to do anything at all with my information, except maybe stick with RP if a switch back to Vic or some other oil shows an up tick in temp. And you're right: I have no idea what's too hot, if such a thing even exists for the Vic engine.
 

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Cool. I think you'll be impressed with the effects of the tuner toward heat. I recently drank the AFR+4 Koolaid. I changed spark plugs and was not happy with what they were saying about the internal temps and fuel ratio.

Went that direction for reasons of no dyno tuner that will touch anything but a HD in the area that I could find and the rave reviews from a couple of Vic boards. I doubt it is "better" than others but the best option I really had without a lot of travel or just guessing.

Anyway the temp dropped to near GW level on the pillion as per Lostwife. Seems a bit more peppy as well, Different would be the best description, and gas mileage went to 45+/-, from 41-42.
No pipes yet, mostly because I'm a cheap ba%&#@d, and I hate loud pipes. LOL
Best wishes on your quest.

Cheers
 

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I just remembered I had an old (Vic, OEM) filter in my recycle tub from last weeks oil change
I got 3.410" with my micrometer.
Hope that helps...
 
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