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Discussion Starter #1
Are the mirrors metric thread? Or will Harley custom mirrors fit?
 

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Or, to put it another way, almost everyone else's mirrors will fit our bikes with no adapters :)


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Discussion Starter #4
So, that brings up another question (in my mind) ...

If Victory is a US made bike, why does it use metric sized threads?

Anyhoo, thanks for the adapter link.
 

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I believe the understanding is because Victory is a new bike they have to conform to world wide standards, which is metric. Harley is grand fathered so they do not have to use metric fasteners.


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There isn't a regulatory imperative but there is an economic penalty. Practically every other country manufactures to metric standards so using our standards creates issues that are normally solved at added cost to American manufacturers.

Since most manufacturing is offshore getting tooling for instance in standard hardware sizing is a per unit added cost that does not provide any engineering benefit. If your primary focus is reduced cost at delivery then it doesn't make sense to invite increased cost with no improvement in product.

On the other side of the equation, exporting American goods that use standard fasteners to metrified countries costs the end users because maintenance tools are specials. Why buy an American product that comes with added burden when you can buy a comparable product that you are tooled to work on already?

Because it's a Harley, that's why. Because it's an American product steeped in the flag and ownership for many is a statement about being American. For many foreign owners Harley ownership includes showing solidarity.

Some things continue to exist just because they continue the iconography. Buicks have vents, HoJo's have orange roofs, Harleys have SAE.
 

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So, that brings up another question (in my mind) ...

If Victory is a US made bike, why does it use metric sized threads?

Anyhoo, thanks for the adapter link.
Every new design is supposed to be metric. There was legislation about it, don't remember what it was or if it had any teeth.
Try using a standard size wrench on a Chevy, Ford, or Dodge. All "American" cars. It won't work out very well.

More than you probably wanted to know about it. http://lamar.colostate.edu/~hillger/laws/metric-conv.html
 

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A better question would be, in light of the world economy, why is the US pretty much the only industrialized country that HASN'T converted to metric?
A lot of folks are resistant to this, probably due to tools obtained over time, or possibly because that's what they grew up with.
I am kind of surprised that the Metric system hasn't completely taken over yet. I kind of prefer it!
 

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Every new design is supposed to be metric. There was legislation about it, don't remember what it was or if it had any teeth.
Try using a standard size wrench on a Chevy, Ford, or Dodge. All "American" cars. It won't work out very well.

More than you probably wanted to know about it. http://lamar.colostate.edu/~hillger/laws/metric-conv.html
I changed the oil in Honeys 2013 Wrangler yesterday. The drain plug is 1/2 " bolt head. !2 mm was sloppy 1/2 " was snug. :confused:
 

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Discussion Starter #12
There isn't a regulatory imperative but there is an economic penalty. Practically every other country manufactures to metric standards so using our standards creates issues that are normally solved at added cost to American manufacturers.

Since most manufacturing is offshore getting tooling for instance in standard hardware sizing is a per unit added cost that does not provide any engineering benefit. If your primary focus is reduced cost at delivery then it doesn't make sense to invite increased cost with no improvement in product.

On the other side of the equation, exporting American goods that use standard fasteners to metrified countries costs the end users because maintenance tools are specials. Why buy an American product that comes with added burden when you can buy a comparable product that you are tooled to work on already?

Because it's a Harley, that's why. Because it's an American product steeped in the flag and ownership for many is a statement about being American. For many foreign owners Harley ownership includes showing solidarity.

Some things continue to exist just because they continue the iconography. Buicks have vents, HoJo's have orange roofs, Harleys have SAE.
Thanks Pop (and others) for the explanations.

Now I wonder.... is the USA run by Harley owners? LMAO!
 

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I changed the oil in Honeys 2013 Wrangler yesterday. The drain plug is 1/2 " bolt head. !2 mm was sloppy 1/2 " was snug. :confused:
actually, it's a 13mm, which is common on Chryslers. Also, the plug itself is metric at 14mmX1.5, which Chrysler has used since the early 90s.

I'm pretty comfortable with both metric and SAE, and have complete sets for both tools. I've got a '73 Ford and a '08 Mercury in the stable, so I need both to wrench on 'em (neither of 'em seem to need it much besides routine maintenance). However, I've found it's easier to find a metric tool to fit a Standard fastener than vice versa, so frequently I'll only grab a metric set if I'm just dinking around.

About the only time I'm annoyed at having to deal with one standard or the other is if there's BOTH on something. Had to do head gaskets on my '89 Blazer. All the head bolts, manifold bolts and rocker nuts were SAE but the accessory bracket, radiator mounts and throttle body fasteners were metric.

No joke, that'll piss ya off.
 

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There was a lot of resistance to going metric in Canada in the '70's. Changing packaging sizes and reworking printing costs were the main complaints but with the rest of the world headed that way it was inevitable. Anyone who was already out of school had to convert over but as usual the kids just rolled along with it. I still think in the Imperial measurements and sometimes have to explain what an inch, foot or mile is. Volumes are supposed to be easier due to the base 10 factors but it's still all Greek to me. Because of our big neighbour to the south many things are still of the Imperial measurement which means having twice the tools around you need. Not that that's a bad thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
There was a lot of resistance to going metric in Canada in the '70's. Changing packaging sizes and reworking printing costs were the main complaints but with the rest of the world headed that way it was inevitable. Anyone who was already out of school had to convert over but as usual the kids just rolled along with it. I still think in the Imperial measurements and sometimes have to explain what an inch, foot or mile is. Volumes are supposed to be easier due to the base 10 factors but it's still all Greek to me. Because of our big neighbour to the south many things are still of the Imperial measurement which means having twice the tools around you need. Not that that's a bad thing.
Interesting .... I'm 66 but can remember learning both metric and imperial and converting from one to the other in school. What's also interesting is I only got to grade 9 before I "lit out on my own" so that was long before the 70's. I did; however, go back to complete my GED when I was in my mid 20's.

As for twice the tools .... heck, the more the merrier LOL
 

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The US has converted to metric. Up until 4-1/2 years ago, i worked as an auto tech. You'll find metric on all "american" cars. You actually find both.
 

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OK then! I have no problem going all metric----but why the heck do all my autos and bikes have metric, but when I go to work on the washing machine, hot tub, refrigerator or my grandsons tricycle it may be SAE? I got plenty of both tools, just hate walking BACK to the garage after finding out I bought the wrong stuff in. :(
 

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There isn't a regulatory imperative but there is an economic penalty. Practically every other country manufactures to metric standards so using our standards creates issues that are normally solved at added cost to American manufacturers.

Since most manufacturing is offshore getting tooling for instance in standard hardware sizing is a per unit added cost that does not provide any engineering benefit. If your primary focus is reduced cost at delivery then it doesn't make sense to invite increased cost with no improvement in product.

On the other side of the equation, exporting American goods that use standard fasteners to metrified countries costs the end users because maintenance tools are specials. Why buy an American product that comes with added burden when you can buy a comparable product that you are tooled to work on already?

Because it's a Harley, that's why. Because it's an American product steeped in the flag and ownership for many is a statement about being American. For many foreign owners Harley ownership includes showing solidarity.

Some things continue to exist just because they continue the iconography. Buicks have vents, HoJo's have orange roofs, Harleys have SAE.
2000 ISO GM and the rest went total metric thumb up
 

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ISO is a voluntary standard. Actually it's a membership standard. You get to pay for the privilege of ISO accreditation, however vague and superfluous and beaurocratically overcomplicated that may be. Harley and others have proven how toothless it is and as an aside they have further proven that ISO isn't even a decent sales gimmick. It's supposed to lubricate international commerce in the manufacturing sector but what it does do is relay to others what you say you do and how you say you do it. We call that smoke and mirrors out in the trenches.

American manufacturers can be fully ISO compliant without using a single metric device or using a mish mosh. Harley is proof. If you are an ISO standards company and you use SAE fasteners after signing off on documents that state that you pledge to use euro fastener gauges exclusively and that comes to light in an ISO audit then the ultimate penalty would be for you to lose the privilege of paying ISO for membership and inspection. ISO will bend over backwards to not lose that revenue stream so it's a fine for you. Gee, mo money, mo money, mo money. Just plain junk '90's newspeak methodology with little if any cost to product benefit besides banners and logos unless you are marketing to entities that are so ISO starstruck that they incorporate compliance into their specs and thus incur the stupid money adders that come with compliance. Seems backwards. I would pay them to stay the hell away from me. Just another regulatory con game created to make cheap stuff more expensive and to distribute that profit to pinheads who are wasting the breathing air productive humans could be inhaling.

Again, the economics recommend metrication but regulatory efforts in the USA never became enforceable except where agreed to by the manufacturers who employ it not only to massage their manufacturing costs but to point their fingers at manufacturers who don't.

A bolt is a bolt. What gauge it is cut to is a statement.
 

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Well, this went way off topic.

All this over a simple little question about a mirror. :crzy:
 
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