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Discussion Starter #1
howdy

i have noticed that i have started sliding a bit at intersection-turn roll outs...now then...i have started twisting her a bit more better...but the tread looks a bit thin on my stock elites...(10.5k)

question is...how many miles are yall getting on a set of stock elites and is there a better tire for the XC?

i ran metz on my vtx and consider them to have been peachy..12k on the stock dunnie 16k on the first metz then sold at after another 5 or so...and they looked new...given i was not pushing the x like the vic (much)

anyway gotta trip coming up and figured now...so ..what is yall's mileage? does this bike eat tires like i am told a wing does?
 

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howdy

i have noticed that i have started sliding a bit at intersection-turn roll outs...now then...i have started twisting her a bit more better...but the tread looks a bit thin on my stock elites...(10.5k)

question is...how many miles are yall getting on a set of stock elites and is there a better tire for the XC?

i ran metz on my vtx and consider them to have been peachy..12k on the stock dunnie 16k on the first metz then sold at after another 5 or so...and they looked new...given i was not pushing the x like the vic (much)

anyway gotta trip coming up and figured now...so ..what is yall's mileage? does this bike eat tires like i am told a wing does?
I changed the dunlops @ 12k. I put on Metzler 880'S. Love the way the bike handles with the Metzlers. I have had good luck with them on other brand of bikes. I hope to get better than 12k time will tell.
 

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A lot depends on the roads you ride on, the temperature, how aggressive you brake and accelerate, how much you use the back brakes vs the front brakes, etc.

Out here where we get over 113 just about every day for 2 months and over 100 for another 2 months; tires don't last very long. I'll be going to a car tire on the back of my XC when it's due. Got 4200 on it now and still looks good but it hasn't been through a summer yet. :)
 

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I changed the dunlops @ 12k. I put on Metzler 880'S. Love the way the bike handles with the Metzlers. I have had good luck with them on other brand of bikes. I hope to get better than 12k time will tell.
New to the XC, but 10k doesn't sound bad to me. I just traded in a 2006 Vulcan 2000, and I couldn't get 5k from a rear motorcycle tire. I went the "darkside" car tire route on that.

Will probably do the same on the Vic when its time. I saw notes on a few people doing the CT on Visions. http://darkside.nwff.info/database.php
 

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The first of every month I check my air.
As it heats up I see a change in the air pressure along with when it gets cold.
40 front and rear for me.
You'll find fools who never check there air till they get a oil change from the dealer but they have well paying jobs and don't think weather changes there air pressure. There all so think that the dealer checks there air.
15 thousand on the rear elite 3 and now a darksider and 25 thousand miles
 

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Lattimer and Bbob, why are you going to a car tire when the design parameters and characteristics are entirely different than what a motorcycle requires and it will devastate the handling capabilities? Is tire life more valuable than your life?
 

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Lattimer and Bbob, why are you going to a car tire when the design parameters and characteristics are entirely different than what a motorcycle requires and it will devastate the handling capabilities? Is tire life more valuable than your life?

I have had this discussion hundreds of times with multiple different people on different sites. The right car tire works just fine. I've logged over 15,000 miles on car tires on my previous bike with no issues whatsoever. Rode in rain, wet, gravel, dry, had a sudden blowout....never once had any pucker factor at all from the tire.

The fact is that a heavy cruiser compresses a car tire such that the tire contact patch is always significantly larger than a motorcycle tire. That leads to better traction in all conditions, handling that is different, but not bad, and substantially increased tire life.

There is a community of long-distance riders with bigger bikes (Goldwings, VTX, Valkyrie, VN 2000, etc) who have done a lot of work figuring out the right tires to use.

Its not for everybody.....but I know it works fine for me.
 

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You have me curious, what would be the "right" car tire for motorcycle application? What happens when heeled over in a tight turn and you are only on the edge of the squarish car tire tread? I too have read considerably about installing car tires on motorcycles and the result among the experts is unanimous....don't do it. So please sate my curiosity. I wonder what KevinX would say about this. Kevin?
 

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You have me curious, what would be the "right" car tire for motorcycle application? What happens when heeled over in a tight turn and you are only on the edge of the squarish car tire tread? I too have read considerably about installing car tires on motorcycles and the result among the experts is unanimous....don't do it. So please sate my curiosity. I wonder what KevinX would say about this. Kevin?
Most of the "experts" are misinformed and have never actually witnessed exactly how a CT performs on a bike. Most are also overly cautious due to legal ramifications.......

You never actually end up on the edge. I've had multiple people ride behind me and they were amazed at what they saw vs what they expected.

You generally want a fairly soft compound, directional tread performance tire. Favorites for the Vulcans are the General Altimax and the Goodyear Triple Tread. I had great results with a Michelin Pilot as well.
 

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Lattimer,
Would you run Deal's Gap with car tires on your bike?
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
howdy

well i do the 40 40 too...and typically check after about 10 miles or so...and it is hot here too...talked to the dealer and they are talking about de-lam on the metz and will not sell or mount them...first i heard about this cause my experience is great on the honda....anyway...stock-elites it is...gotta keep the dealer alive you know...they are a good bunch down here...


and about the CTs....go over to the VTXOA....the fellas there call it the dark side....plenty of VTXrs doing it from what i gather ....although i cannot "get it" myself.

VTXOA honda VTX owners associations ICYDK
 

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As far as ME880s go I used them on my VN1600 with great success. I used the 180/80-16 for the Goldwing and got over 16k on the rear. I put on the standard 180/80 and only got 12k. I tried to Darkside that bike but couldn't find a tire that didn't rub the driveshaft tube. But the little I rode on it I liked it.

I have a friend with a car tire on his 'wing. Actually on his second. He ran his pressure to high on the first tire, it crowned and seemed to wear out the middle of the tread patch pretty fast. He learned his lesson and is running some sort of run flat tire now. Can't remember the brand. If you want to see someone lean a bike over on a CT follow him someday. And if you haven't seen it you won't believe how much that sidewall flexes and how much contact that tire has with the road as he is leaned over. I also have a friend that runs one o. An 1100 Sabre. I believe he has an Ultimax on his. I still have the 2 CTs I tried on the Vulcan in the garage. I may try one on my XC when the time comes.

Remember, you should not say it is not good. You should say you don't like it. Then you know you are perfectly safe!
 

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You have me curious, what would be the "right" car tire for motorcycle application? What happens when heeled over in a tight turn and you are only on the edge of the squarish car tire tread? I too have read considerably about installing car tires on motorcycles and the result among the experts is unanimous....don't do it. So please sate my curiosity. I wonder what KevinX would say about this. Kevin?
please read the info on this link this will answer most if not all questions regarding car tires on motorcycles
http://forums.delphiforums.com/DarkSiding
 

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This may be just "my" opinion, but the car tire thing to me is total BS. I've got an 04 Roadstar & road another Roadstar that had a CT. The owner of that bike love the CT, rides a few iron butt rides every year and continues to swear by 'em. I rode his bike and in all honesty it handled like crap. His Roadstar rolled smoothly, but cornering was difficult. A Roadstar takes some work when riding twisties & with a CT it takes significantly more work. Just doesn't transition from turn to turn as smoothly as mine does. Please keep in mind that I'm an agressive rider & my buddy is NOT. He's a rider that rides up to 5mph over the speed limit as his max, especially in corners. I on the other hand ride nearly as fast as the roadstar can in the corners & my floorboards can prove it.
So for "ME" a CT is the worst thing you can do if you're looking for the best handling your bike can provide.
 

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Thanks for submitting that Steve. I have been patiently waiting for someone who has ridden the same bike with both types of tires to comment. It stands to reason that a bike can not possibly handle (i.e. corner) similarly with a car tire as with a MC tire. CTs are for those riders you describe: slow and straight up and/or are not aggressive in the twisties. I have been behind riders who actually take curves with their bike straight up, not leaned. How do they do that?? Good candidates for the CT thing.
 

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I won't debate whether or not CT's are better. I've been there done that on an HD forum and it was completely unproductive. What I can tell you is most people who switched to darksiding didn't go back to the conventional MC tires (MT's). Also it takes a minimum of 100 miles of riding to get use to a CT. For some people it's as much as 300 miles so just taking a little ride on a buddy's bike doesn't cut it unless it's an all day ride through various type riding like straights and twisties.

Now; some CT's are more rounded than others and you will get that "stand up" feel when leaned into a corner more with a flatter tire. Sweeps are different. Most people find CT's to grip better and inspire more confidence once they are use to them.

I had a CT on a HD Night Train. I was the first person on the most popular HD forum to be vocal about it. Now hundreds, if not thousands, are doing it on HD's. To run a CT there must be a minimum wheel width and clearance. Only the 09 and newer HD touring bikes and certain Softail models have that in the HD line. I don't know which bikes in the Victory line they will work on other than the Vision, XC, XR, Hammer, and Jackpot. Generally speaking, if the stock MT is at least 180 wide, you can find a CT to fit it unless it's some really odd height or sidewall ratio.

When I traded in my Night Train w/CT for a Jackpot with 250 rear tire; it felt pretty much the same to me even though the JP had a MT on the back. The mere width of the tire was enough to give that "stand up" feel.

I like this video for illustrating just how much actual CT is on the road. Notice it's a more rounded style.


Here are a bunch more video's. Notice how the more squared off tires look and touch the road.

Here's a tire that's overly inflated for this application and doesn't look to be very rounded. This is not a tire I'd run and certainly not overly inflated like this one is. I imagine this is the way most people envision a CT on a motorcycle. If this is the case then we are in agreement. This is not the way to to do it.


A very big thing with CT's is finding the correct tire pressure. Most people tend to run them much too high. A lower, but within safe limits, pressure will yield the best ride. Id does take a little getting use to how the radial CT moves though. Kind of a squishy feeling for lack of a better term.

One more note. Darksiding is for cruisers only. Running them on a sport bike with the extreme lean angles they have; just wouldn't work. Because cruisers don't have those lean angles and generally how people ride cruisers; it works. If you are familiar with the Boss Hoss bikes with the big V8 engines; you might also know they ran CT's for a long time before a company started making tires just for them.

Darksiding goes back to the first half of the last century and is nothing new. What's new is the radial tires. They completely changed the way CT's handle on MC's.

Also, for whatever reason, CT technology is at least 25 years ahead of MT technology. Otherwise we would be getting 50k miles out of MT's.
 

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Cage Tire Life vs. Moto Tire Life

I realize that there must be a simple answer to why a cage tire lasts so much longer than a moto tire, but I just can't come up with an answer. After all a cage weighs more and the front tire would seem to get more wear as a result of more traction during turning.
So, what's the deal?
 

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A combination of things Top. First the CT has a lot more tread to start with and second, as hard as it might be to believe, the CT is a softer compound so it gives without wearing out so quickly. Mostly though; a CT simply has more tread.

The softer compound has more to do with the better traction and braking characteristics of the CT. The CT I ran gave me more confidence in the sweeps and the tar snakes were 80% better to deal with. I assume because there was more contact patch on the road.
 
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