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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Folks

I have a 2012 Vegas with factory stage1 (exhaust and filter) and Lloydz timing wheel at +4 setting. I was thinking what will be the next best upgrade
- Torque tubes Intake
- Cams

Which should be the next upgrade between the 2 for bang for buck and do I need a PCV with either of the upgrades?

Thanks
fak005
 

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@fak005 I think cams would give you the bast bang for your buck, even with only the stage 1 air filter. Yes you will absolutely need some type of fuel controller and tuning if you do cams(or torque tubes or both...)
 

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Yeah do the lot if you can afford it,
If you're anything like me then you'll end up with the lot anyway!
Just a question of in what order......
I did Torquetubes first, and a PCV.
You're gonna end up getting a PCV anyway.
You'll probably find your "stage 1" pipes cheat you out of power whichever way you progress.
I ended up going to RPW pipes last through my own pig 🐷 headedness, also I had Freedom Performance Slash pipes on the bike when I bought it.
As it turned out some bad luck when a big dog rammed my front wheel sending the bike down the road in its lhs shearing off the gear selector and caused internal gearbox issues.
So while the bike was off the road and down for repairs I bit the bullet, sold one of my vintage cars and ploughed the money into big bore and cams.
Turning a negative situation into a positive one.
There's no substitute for big cubes and. 495 cams!
But they must me able to breathe in and out via Torquetubes and good exhaust.
Most of us are dictated to by the dollar on how far we go and in what order.
I sort of went the wrong way about things but in the end luck, fate, and a crash steered my build.
If not for the crash I doubt I would've gone for the cubes and cams.
But I tell you what....I'm damn glad I did!
Your financial position will dictate where you go and in what order.
Keep us in the loop hey.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thank you all for the response. What do you think will be better VM1-DR or LSC cams?
Also Lloydz tuner or PVC 5?

Thanks
fak005
 

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Thank you all for the response. What do you think will be better VM1-DR or LSC cams?
Also Lloydz tuner or PVC 5?

Thanks
fak005
Lloydz HOH. 495 cams in steel frame, cam carriers will need to be clearance to get em in.
PCV
 

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Thank you all for the response. What do you think will be better VM1-DR or LSC cams?
Also Lloydz tuner or PVC 5?

Thanks
fak005
This was a choice I had to make.....The LSC cams are ground to peak power lower in the rpms vs. the DR1's. After reading all I could and talking with a buddy using the DR1's, then finding the DR1's for $90 less than the LSC's. The DR1's went in.
I have absolutely no regrets :cool: I gained 21hp and 3 lbs tq, and a more lumpy, throaty sound.... In "normal" riding I feel no loss of low end(its the opposite actually, there's more power in all the rpm's I ride in) but when I want to accelerate, especially passing, this cammed engine pulls much harder and longer(right up to 5500 rpms)...I love it.
PC-V all the way
 

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DR1 seem to be the best for steel frames. I love mine. The Torque Tubes in my opinion? You won't find anything close to those regardless of the hype and BS being disseminated around the forums on other intakes.

If you want to start smaller with the cams...I have a [email protected] I'll sell cheap for the 106 that works decently with those cams. Its good in the mid to upper ranges, but a tad doggish on the low end with more open pipes. Depends on how you ride.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Thanks everyone for your responses.
I am a little confused here on Lloydz wheel which I already have installed but am looking at installing PC V, if I have the setting on wheel at +4, does this advance timing through the rpm range or only below 2500?

Also, if I bump up the advance timing from +4 to +6, can the PCV help here from preventing engine from pinging?

Do I need to remove the wheel to change the setting?

thanks fak005
 

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The timing wheel affects the timing all the way through the rpm range. Each engine is a little different but the majority do well at +4. There have been some that did best at -1 or -2; not many though. You don't need to remove the wheel but you do need to take the cover off and loosen it so you can move it then make sure you torque it to spec again.

The PC-V can only affect timing above 2500 rpm. You're of course welcome to do what you think is best but many of us let the timing wheel deal with the timing and set the advance to 0 in the PC-V tuning software then apply it. That way the timing is linear through the entire rpm range.

Again, it's up to you, but if it were mine; I'd retard the timing before changing the timing in the PC-V. Now a professional dyno tuner can make all those changes because he can see the real world results instantly on his screen. If you have access to a dyno maybe you can too.
 

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Heres why its best to get a Pro Dyno TUNER to tune your bike not just a Dyno OPERATOR.
My Vegas has repeated 'tunes' as Ive upgraded stuff.
The Dyno Operator looked after me moneywise but hey he let the machine do the tuning.
Theres a program where they set the parameters and the machine gets it fairly close.
Might be ok on an average bike and the bike felt gutsy!
By the butt dyno it felt great.....but!.....
By the numbersit wasnt up where it should be.
Plenty torque around 120 ftlb but power not where I'd expect.
I contacted an Ace tuner at Springwood he asked for my fuelling graph....didnt have one so I requested one off the guy who had bee tuning my bike.
I sent it to Kevinx and also to Fred at Pro cycle Dyno
Both said it was all over the place like a mad womans ****.
Fred booked me in 9 days later for Dyno Tune.
Which is exactly what I got. A very meticulous tune of both cylinders.
Now get this.

Fred took a shitload of fuel out of it...fair enough.
Then tried a timing increase...did nothing!
So he tried taking timing OUT of it!
Took total of ELEVEN DEGREES of timing out of it.
And gained me Ten Horsepower.
Thats the difference a Dyno Tuner makes.
At the drags the bike went point two seconds quicker and five mph faster, under race conditions.
I reckon itll go even quicker and faster with practice.
You live in a country that has the top Dyno TUNERS right there.
The other fellas have answered your other qustions .
Every engine is different.
 

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Just curious, what were your dyno numbers?
114HP @ 5900rpm , 124 FT/LB @3820rpm, at the back wheel

and on the black dyno [email protected]
https://youtu.be/549NDND-pG0
I'm lane closest, gets off the line good :)

PS..Fred at Procycle said there's another ten horse to be had with a big 2-1 exhaust but I'm happy just the way it is, nice to ride, feels real strong .
 

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My in power upgrades

I am happy with the following set up on a 2009 100 cu. inch Vegas:
-RPW Thor exhaust
-Lloydz Torque Tubes
-Lloydz LSC cams
-Maximus Tuner
I went down an expensive rabbit hole to get to a satisfying performance ending up with 104HP/109TQ and no more running too rich. The journey included: Cobra Fi2000 auto tune fuel manager (now somewhere in the city dump) & Cobra Tri-Oval exhaust (now in my attic).

When I replaced the Tri-ovals with the RPW's the dyno jumped 15 hp / 4 ft lbs torque.
Then... replacing the Fi2000 with the Maximus, and adding LSC cams & Torque Tubes I gained another 15 hp / 6 ft lbs torque.

I was warned about the Fi2000 by this forum and bought the damn thing anyway - bad move. I bought the tri-ovals when I bought the bike before I knew this forum existed - should have done my homework...$$$$$$
 

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I am happy with the following set up on a 2009 100 cu. inch Vegas:
-RPW Thor exhaust
-Lloydz Torque Tubes
-Lloydz LSC cams
-Maximus Tuner
I went down an expensive rabbit hole to get to a satisfying performance ending up with 104HP/109TQ and no more running too rich. The journey included: Cobra Fi2000 auto tune fuel manager (now somewhere in the city dump) & Cobra Tri-Oval exhaust (now in my attic).

When I replaced the Tri-ovals with the RPW's the dyno jumped 15 hp / 4 ft lbs torque.
Then... replacing the Fi2000 with the Maximus, and adding LSC cams & Torque Tubes I gained another 15 hp / 6 ft lbs torque.

I was warned about the Fi2000 by this forum and bought the damn thing anyway - bad move. I bought the tri-ovals when I bought the bike before I knew this forum existed - should have done my homework...$$$$$$
Thats good to know....main difference is my 109 cubes and lumpier cams, yet it's very well mannered down low to mid and ballistic up top:devil
My detailed PCV tune set me back $450 but well worth it gaining me 10 horse and 11 ft lbs at 5000rpm.....money well spent.
They say mods are never finished,....mine are:smile
 

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I did the dr1 cams, torque tubes, rpw Thor, timing wheel, and pc5. My final numbers were 123 rwhp, 120 tq with a nice fat torque curve. It was tuned by Coastal Victory in myrtle beach during bike week 2016. It's well worth it. A whole different animal
 
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