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Discussion Starter #1
Ran across a mechanical engineers blog on motor oils on line and after some reading I thought that others here might find it of value.
He apparently is a gear head looking for better oils for his race motors. Lots of good information as well as a lot of test results.

Many of the oils that tested high can't be used in Vic's because of their wet clutches, but most of us have other things besides Vic's that need oil changes. It's interesting to to note from the tests that price in not an indicator of ability in motor oils.


https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/
 

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He does get to a couple motorcycle oils.

a quick read through notables, Amsoil scored the highest marks in his tests.


5W30 Motul 300V Ester Core 4T Racing Oil, synthetic (lab tested 2014)

This Motorcycle Road Racing oil is from France and comes in liter bottles (slightly more than a quart). At the time this oil was tested in spring 2014, it cost $24.25 per bottle. And with the shipping cost added to that, the final cost was about $33.00 per bottle (shipping was all inside the U.S.), making it THE most expensive motor oil I’ve ever tested.
Silicon = 6 ppm (anti-foaming agent in new oil, but in used oil, certain gasket materials and dirt can also add to this number)
Boron = 4 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge, anti-wear)
Magnesium = 17 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Calcium = 3141 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Barium = 0 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Zinc = 1724 ppm (anti-wear)
Phos = 1547 ppm (anti-wear)
Moly = 481 ppm (anti-wear)
Potassium = 4 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
Sodium = 3 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
TBN = 7.4 (Total Base Number is an acid neutralizer to prevent corrosion. Most gasoline engine motor oils start with TBN around 8 or 9)
Viscosity (cSt at 100*C) = 11.2 (cSt range for SAE 30 is 9.3 to 12.4) And cSt (centistokes) in general terms, represents an oil’s thickness.

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This oil contains sufficient amounts of the components required (detergent, acid neutralizer, etc) for normal change intervals in street driven vehicles. But, it has way too much zinc/phos for use in cat equipped vehicles. However, it is well suited for Race Cars, Street Hotrods and Classic cars.

Valvoline 10W40 4 Stroke Motorcycle Oil API SJ conventional (lab tested 2008)
Silicon = 20 ppm (anti-foaming agent in new oil, but in used oil, certain gasket materials and dirt can also add to this number)
Boron = 137 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge, anti-wear)
Magnesium = 13 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Calcium = 1849 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Barium = 0 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Zinc = 1154 ppm (anti-wear)
Phos = 1075 ppm (anti-wear)
Moly = 0 ppm (anti-wear)
Potassium = 0 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
Sodium = 126 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
TBN = 7.1 (Total Base Number is an acid neutralizer to prevent corrosion. Most gasoline engine motor oils start with TBN around 8 or 9)
Viscosity (cSt at 100*C) = 14.6 (cSt range for SAE 40 is 12.5 to 16.2) And cSt (centistokes) in general terms, represents an oil’s thickness.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
He does make a good argument that reduced zinc is not a problem in motor oils that are used in high performance motors.
 

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a quick read through notables, Amsoil scored the highest marks in his tests.


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Not sure how you came to that conclusion?

In the WEAR PROTECTION RANKING LIST Amsoil is ranked 23rd, 29th, 45th, 55th, 108th and below depending on which Amsoil was tested.

Did I miss something? :smile
 

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This was posted 2 months ago by another member ... Anyway, a bit over my head ... Buttttt

Somebody should write this man and ask what oil is the best for Victory motorcycles .... Should be nice to see his answer ...
Does redline give clutch slippage ?

Amsoil 20w50 ??

And a very strong point he made about diesel oil being bad to put in petrol engines ... Just imagine wet clutch / vtwin ....

Andre
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TaPaTaLk
 

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Discussion Starter #6
This was posted 2 months ago by another member ... Anyway, a bit over my head ... Buttttt

Somebody should write this man and ask what oil is the best for Victory motorcycles .... Should be nice to see his answer ...
Does redline give clutch slippage ?

Amsoil 20w50 ??

And a very strong point he made about diesel oil being bad to put in petrol engines ... Just imagine wet clutch / vtwin ....

Andre
@
TaPaTaLk
Too bad he is testing for race cars and not Victory Motorcycles huh.

Most of the top rated oils that he tested aren't usable in a Victory precisely because of the wet clutch.
You'd have to go down the list and research which oils are designed to be used with wet clutch.

I find it fascinating that price can have very little to do with how good an oil is and that some of the brands that you would assume produced top shelf stuff across the board produce many average to mediocre to low quality products when actually tested as sold.
On the other hand some of the least likely oils, like chevron 5w 30 conventional, the stuff you buy at Costco cheaply out performs a lot of synthetics.

It would nice if he could test some Polaris oil then we would have a baseline as to compare the diesel oils that he has already tested to.
 

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Too bad he is testing for race cars and not Victory Motorcycles huh.

Most of the top rated oils that he tested aren't usable in a Victory precisely because of the wet clutch.
You'd have to go down the list and research which oils are designed to be used with wet clutch.

I find it fascinating that price can have very little to do with how good an oil is and that some of the brands that you would assume produced top shelf stuff across the board produce many average to mediocre to low quality products when actually tested as sold.
On the other hand some of the least likely oils, like chevron 5w 30 conventional, the stuff you buy at Costco cheaply out performs a lot of synthetics.

It would nice if he could test some Polaris oil then we would have a baseline as to compare the diesel oils that he has already tested to.
Yes ..... True ... Coz I test the vic oil every time ...

And I can only do 6500 Km between oil changes ... Then the vic oil start deteriorating .. but the book states 8000 km

This is not good

Andre
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I notice at around 5000km the oil in my Vic starts to breakdown... Shifting gets worse. I usual run it to 6-7000 km and change it. I think I am going to use the Rotella on the next change.
 

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I'm not sure what to do, there is amsoil 20W50 available in the next country ... And it seems redline is available HERE on the island ... But aren't these diesel engine oils ?? And according to the website above that's the worst you can do ..

Andre
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TaPaTaLk
 

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That's a really BIG read....seriously...has anyone read it all?
Not me....long winded stuff loses me that's for sure.
 

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I think one of the Oil Guru's we have on this forum needs to study this ... Coz my brain just seased trying to find stuff good for Vic's ...

Grrrrrrrr

Andre
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TaPaTaLk
 

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I think one of the Oil Guru's we have on this forum needs to study this ... Coz my brain just seased trying to find stuff good for Vic's ...

Grrrrrrrr

Andre
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TaPaTaLk
Sounds like you need to go for a ride mate.
 

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This was posted 2 months ago by another member ... Anyway, a bit over my head ... Buttttt

Somebody should write this man and ask what oil is the best for Victory motorcycles .... Should be nice to see his answer ...
Does redline give clutch slippage ?

Amsoil 20w50 ??

And a very strong point he made about diesel oil being bad to put in petrol engines ... Just imagine wet clutch / vtwin ....

Andre
@
TaPaTaLk
Wow, that's an hour of my life I'll never get back and the old adage If ya can't dazzle them with brilliance baffle them with bullshit comes to mind.. The dude makes some good points however, maybe I can put the oil threads about what oil is best for our beloved Victory's to bed once and for all.

That Dude stated his qualifications so I'll state mine; BS in Mechanical Engineering with my studies devoted to Failure Analysis(why stuff breaks and wears) I have an Aircraft Mechanic's Certificate (A&P) with all the ratings, Airframe, Powerplant, Inspection Authorization (IA, which means I can sign off on major repairs and alterations of aircraft and do annual inspections, anyone have an idea of the training and knowledge that requires?). Anyone that knows me in real life, and there's a few here, knows I'm a good wrench and if I've touched your motorcycle you know I'm anal and an absolute perfectionist. It's my aircraft training, bad Aircraft mechanics kill people.

I'm a lifelong mechanic. Test data is all well and good but the real world is a different animal. I'll put a couple hundred thousand on my Victory and I'll rebuild it, then I'll do it again. These motors are over engineered but like ALL mechanical things problems do arise, fix it or sell it and move on. The Enga-nerd in me did copious amounts of research on Victory before I bought it and I STILL bought one. Run the piss out of it, fuel it, repeat.

Look Kids, If you run a quality oil and filter that's safe for the clutch as it lives in the engine oil and you change it regularly you're fine, period end of story. We DO NOT have high performance engines and I don't care if you add cams, turbo, supercharger, big bore kit, fairy dust or Unicorn farts, it still will not be a high performance engine with the pressures that involves. I'm not debating anyone about oil, there's been times in my life when I've had aircraft engines and motorcycle engines apart in two different shops at the same time. I've seen wear and failures. Once again...tst data, real world, two different animals.

My advice to end all advice, Run a quality oil and filter and change it. Good night, sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite.
 

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Wow, that's an hour of my life I'll never get back and the old adage If ya can't dazzle them with brilliance baffle them with bullshit comes to mind.. The dude makes some good points however, maybe I can put the oil threads about what oil is best for our beloved Victory's to bed once and for all.

That Dude stated his qualifications so I'll state mine; BS in Mechanical Engineering with my studies devoted to Failure Analysis(why stuff breaks and wears) I have an Aircraft Mechanic's Certificate (A&P) with all the ratings, Airframe, Powerplant, Inspection Authorization (IA, which means I can sign off on major repairs and alterations of aircraft and do annual inspections, anyone have an idea of the training and knowledge that requires?). Anyone that knows me in real life, and there's a few here, knows I'm a good wrench and if I've touched your motorcycle you know I'm anal and an absolute perfectionist. It's my aircraft training, bad Aircraft mechanics kill people.

I'm a lifelong mechanic. Test data is all well and good but the real world is a different animal. I'll put a couple hundred thousand on my Victory and I'll rebuild it, then I'll do it again. These motors are over engineered but like ALL mechanical things problems do arise, fix it or sell it and move on. The Enga-nerd in me did copious amounts of research on Victory before I bought it and I STILL bought one. Run the piss out of it, fuel it, repeat.

Look Kids, If you run a quality oil and filter that's safe for the clutch as it lives in the engine oil and you change it regularly you're fine, period end of story. We DO NOT have high performance engines and I don't care if you add cams, turbo, supercharger, big bore kit, fairy dust or Unicorn farts, it still will not be a high performance engine with the pressures that involves. I'm not debating anyone about oil, there's been times in my life when I've had aircraft engines and motorcycle engines apart in two different shops at the same time. I've seen wear and failures. Once again...tst data, real world, two different animals.

My advice to end all advice, Run a quality oil and filter and change it. Good night, sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite.
So what oil do you use Jamming ??

Ha ha glorious write up mate, love it ....

PS, so why do YOU think vic oil CANNOT make it 8000 Km between oil change ??

Andre
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TaPaTaLk
 

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Rotella T6 with a Wix filter. Every 4000 miles I pop the plug and change it. Cheap insurance.
 

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Rotella T6 with a Wix filter. Every 4000 miles I pop the plug and change it. Cheap insurance.
Right 4000 miles is exactly 6437 Km that's my limit too, after that Vic oil deteriorates FAST :nerd
 
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